karamazov80 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 (edited) For me the main thing I care about in comic movies is getting the spirit right. You need other things as well to make a movie good of course, but that's the main thing for me. Otherwise, like you guys are saying, why bother calling it a comic movie? They aren't tapping into nostalgia and our knowledge/understanding of the comics, but instead just maintaining superficial similarities, for what? To capitalize on some vague name recognition? I think Singer/Vaughn X-Men have succeeded at that. The MCU movies do more or less. Man of Steel totally failed in that area IMO, which was its greatest (of several) sins. If FF does that too, then it will be a bummer. The last couple of movies at least attempted to make them a bit light-hearted and fun (which aren't essential to the FF as a whole, but are key to understanding the intra-team dynamics). Unfortunately, they weren't well written or directed, so it didn't mean much in the final analysis. Very possible this new movie will be excellent, but if they're going to take such extensive liberties (Ragman Doom as a blogger is just the final straw for me), then I'm just not going to be very excited about. There are loads of great movies that I know are out there that aren't comic movies, but I may or may not watch them. Edited November 15, 2014 by karamazov80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiniFiend UK Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 (edited) I feel the same if it wasnt called FF I would be quite happy for another hero movie but this dont sound like FF to me. Just reading that reminds me of when they remade the Italian Job. Call it by any other name and it would be an ok bank heist actiony movie, but it was called the Italian Job an no way was it the Italian job. No good car chase, no blowing the bloody doors off, nothing! Ohh it made me seethe. Edited November 15, 2014 by MiniFiend UK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 There's an awful lot of naysaying considering we haven't seen a frame of film. Yes, Marvel Studios has probably managed to stay closer to the source material than, say, The Dark Knight. But like I said, while that Bat-flick took quite a few liberties, it was still a commercial and critical success. Sin City was pretty damned close to the source material as was The Watchmen. If we're just talking about casting and costumes then the first two Fox FF efforts were also pretty close to comics (they nailed Silver Surfer) but they were still pretty disappointing. (Cloud Galactus and Julian McMahon's Doom both sucked balls.) If FF ends up looking like a found footage film then that could explain why Trank insisted it exist in its own canon outside of the X-Men's universe; the styles simply won't mesh. (I suspect the same thing happened with Ant-Man.) I'm still cautiously optimistic and eager to see the first trailer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Adherence to the source may have nothing to do with a film's commercial, or critical success. It's possible this film will have both, even if it bears almost no resemblance to the FF we've known. But when Doom is an antisocial blogger or whatever, it's not gonna be an easy sell to folks who have a strong affinity for the old comics. I'll happily eat crow if the little information we've heard thus far isn't painting the picture it seems to be, but very little of what we've heard has given me a reason to be excited. And I'm probably as big an FF fan as anyone else around here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stack32 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Yes, Marvel Studios has probably managed to stay closer to the source material than, say, The Dark Knight. But like I said, while that Bat-flick took quite a few liberties, it was still a commercial and critical success. There's a difference between taking a few liberties and showing open contempt for the source material in practically every public statement regarding movie. Not to mention Trank has one mediocre found footage movie under his belt which doesn't exactly inspire confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trekker 42 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Yes, Marvel Studios has probably managed to stay closer to the source material than, say, The Dark Knight. But like I said, while that Bat-flick took quite a few liberties, it was still a commercial and critical success. There's a difference between taking a few liberties and showing open contempt for the source material in practically every public statement regarding movie. Not to mention Trank has one mediocre found footage movie under his belt which doesn't exactly inspire confidence. Really it all depends on what you'd call a mediocre found footage movie. Personally I thought Chronicle was an exceptional found footage movie, possibly the best of the genre. And more than anything it managed to do characterization and action right. Andrew was, to me, an extraordinary compelling and often terrifying character. When it was first announced Josh Trank seemed like the right kind of guy to direct this movie (although I wish Max Landis has the opportunity to write it as he's a massive comic fan and his script for Chronicle was really good) as Fantastic Four would be in good hands with someone whose specialty was both action and good characters. It just seems they've been messing with too much s**t to make it Fantastic Four. I am hopeful that Victor von Blogger will act more like actual Doctor Doom than the jackass from the first two though.The guy playing him did well as the villain in Dawn of the Apes, so yaknow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Sometimes a movie can get all the details right and still miss the spirit. I worry less about the details and more about the spirit. I want out of a comic book movie something that is fun with good action and good characterization. I want it to capture the essence of the source material, but not so much that it becomes a slave to the source. Right now we're sweating the details. I think most Marvel movies and the Dark Knight Trilogy did a fine job of this. But what really gets me is the complete anger about FF changing details when the last comic movie we got was GotG. Which, you know, was completely faithful in retelling a classic Guardians story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stack32 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Comparing to classic Guardians would make sense if that was the book they were basing the movie off of... which they weren't. But one thing that was clear pretty consistently through the development up until release was that GotG was trying to capture the spirit of that book, even if it was strange enough that it jeopardized the mainstream appeal of movie, so most fans were willing to give them a break on the details. All of the statements from people involved about FF so far suggest that they won't get the spirit or the details right and don't care to anyway. That's what the negative reaction is about, not containment suits or blogger Doom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigvis497 Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 For people that say Fantastic Four is too dated to work; How is family specific to any time period? How is exploring the unknown specific to any time period? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 Sometimes a movie can get all the details right and still miss the spirit. I worry less about the details and more about the spirit. I want out of a comic book movie something that is fun with good action and good characterization. I want it to capture the essence of the source material, but not so much that it becomes a slave to the source. Right now we're sweating the details. I think most Marvel movies and the Dark Knight Trilogy did a fine job of this. But what really gets me is the complete anger about FF changing details when the last comic movie we got was GotG. Which, you know, was completely faithful in retelling a classic Guardians story.I see the evidence as being suggestive of the tone and spirit that the film will have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 Comparing to classic Guardians would make sense if that was the book they were basing the movie off of... which they weren't. But one thing that was clear pretty consistently through the development up until release was that GotG was trying to capture the spirit of that book, even if it was strange enough that it jeopardized the mainstream appeal of movie, so most fans were willing to give them a break on the details. All of the statements from people involved about FF so far suggest that they won't get the spirit or the details right and don't care to anyway. That's what the negative reaction is about, not containment suits or blogger Doom. Meh. I intended classic not in the old sense, but in the much-beloved, must-read sense, but even so, I think the point still makes sense. I loved GotG, but when you change almost every character and their origins, you're straying pretty far. And that's OK. I guess I just haven't seen these statements where people reveal the tone and plot of FF. Even if I had, I'd still wait for the movie before I judged it. It might be crap, but it may also give us a vibrant new look at some old favorites. I'll wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 There's a difference between taking a few liberties and showing open contempt for the source material in practically every public statement regarding movie. One fan's contempt is another fan's creative liberty, I suppose. I've yet to read anyone involved in the film talking about contempt for the source material. I guess it's open to interpretation at this point but there's no denying the number of changes Nolan made to the Batman mythos to suit his needs. I regarded his trilogy as an Elseworlds story but it was far from being my ideal Batman story. (Not nearly enough detective work or other disguises and the fact that he was always looking for a way out of the role drove me crazy.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Over at ComicBookMovie, they're saying this may or may not be the outline for the film: Reed is a genius convenience store clerk with Ben. Reed's parents don't care about him, and Ben's dad is abusive. They're good friends and have each other's backs. Reed writes a paper for community college on teleportation that attracts the attention of Dr. Franklin Storm, CEO of the Baxter Building research center.Storm has a son, Johnny, and an adoptive daughter, Sue, whose father, Storm's old partner, died in an experiment gone wrong. Johnny and Sue are party kids, and Sue is particularly disdainful of science. Reed and Sue don't get along at first.Victor Doomashev is a anti-social Eastern European computer programmer and hacktivist who calls himself "Doom". He hates the 1%, particularly Storm, whom he claims corrupts science for profit.Storm uses Reed's paper to complete some equations on a machine to access another dimension, the N-Zone. Reed invites Ben to watch the machine being turned on. Sue and Johnny are also there. Doom manages to hack into the Baxter Building's servers and use a computer virus to damage the machine, which explodes. Reed, Sue, Johnny and Ben are exposed to otherwordly energy and become mutants with powers that they can't control.Storm takes them to the Baxter Building and creates containment suits for their powers. They begin to train. Reed and Storm also begin developing a way to revert the accident. Sue blames Reed for everything, but they eventually become friends and then a couple. Ben can switch off his powers when he's not in danger. Johnny changes colors based on heat intensity, and Sue has some borderline telekinetic thing. Reed is pretty much Reed.Doom finds out that the four have acquired powers and becomes angry it's not him, so he comes up with a plan to break into the Baxter Building to access the N-Zone through the rebuild machine. As a distraction, he reprograms a bunch of stolen military drones, the "Doombots", to attack the building. The four come together as a team for the first time and save people.Doom activates the machine and gets technopathy powers or something, basically energy blasts and making machines obey to him, and a fight ensues. The machine goes critical, and, in order to prevent it from exploding and destroying the city, the four push into it and Storm shuts it off.There's a countdown before it reaches critical mass. Inside the N-Zone, the four battle Doom again, and manage to leave him trapped there after he disfigures himself soaking up too much power. The Four manage to escape, but Ben gets the blunt of it to protect Reed and can't switch back.The machine is destroyed, Doom is gone, the four have learned to work as a team, and Reed vows to find a cure for Ben. And it ends there. See? Much better. (Assuming it's legit.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turtle Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 If legit, that sounds completely fine to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mnemosis Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 That sounds pretty reasonable. I'd have gone with: Reed is a young college professor and Sue and Johnny are in his class to appease their father. Victor is a young nobleman from abroad in the same class. Been is just Reed's best friend I just REALLY hate the hacker angle and the need to give him powers. If he wants powers, maybe the doom armor should have been an attempt to drain of the energies from the four our some such Alternately, have some sort of subterranean monster of Annihilus be the villain of the first film and give Doom a chance to develop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stack32 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Much better? I guess slightly less stinky garbage is technically better, but it's still garbage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I just wish they'd gone with a much younger cast. It bugs me that Sue Storm is the oldest of the Four at 31, at least in terms of the actors' ages. I was expecting teenagers, not folks in their late 20s, early 30s. Are Will Smith's kids really that busy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trekker 42 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I actually kinda like that story. And if they're gonna give Doom any powers, technopathy is probably the best option. Although the energy blasts thing annoys me a bit since, yaknow, the last damn Doom did that and it would up being the Fantastic Four fighting Electro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 http://youtu.be/e-BVs-KCSiA No idea if anything here would make compelling merchandise, if Fox is even bothering with an aggressive licensing program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valo487 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) I think the director of the film is a talented guy, so I didn't expect it to be Batman & Robin level of garbage, my main complaint with it is that aside from the Marvel logo at the beginning, nothing about this looks like a Fantastic Four movie. I think that has been everyone's complaint from the beginning. If they cut the Marvel logo at the beginning, would anyone even know what this is? I guess the biggest compliment I can give it is that I think I would be more interested if it wasn't supposed to be the FF. I couldn't help but notice Wordpress Dr. Doom was nowhere to be found. I still hate that they changed Sue and Johnny's relationship just so the director could cast his buddy. But please DST, skip this one. I don't think there's any danger of Marvel allowing any merchandise to be made, but just in case. Edited January 27, 2015 by Valo487 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPL Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 This reminds me of audience reaction to the Batman Begins teaser. People had such a bad taste in their mouths after Batman & Robin, they were turned off of the franchise. I observed a couple guys watching the Batman Begins trailer for the first time and they were intrigued up until the batsuit was revealed, causing one guy to groan, "Ugh, it's a Batman movie." His companion replied, "I thought it was a Bond film." If that holds true for this film, it'll be great for the movie but terrible for the merchandise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valo487 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 But I don't think people are uninterested because it's Fantastic Four, I think people are uninterested because the first FF movies sucked, and this one looks like it's FF in name only. People want a real Fantastic Four movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSTZach Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Looks cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valo487 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Looks cool! Uh oh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fwoosheyman Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Yea I like this trailer too. I have no faith in the movie but that was a cool trailer. However its easy to make a good trailer with practically no acting and no plot/story shown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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