minimadman Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) So Mirymate or anyone else who might know--does the SSS not delay aging at all? To bobafett's post, I think a linebacker or running back would be a good sized player to take Cap over, if anyone that size has any ability to act. Steve Rogers was born on July 4th 1917 and was frozen in ice in 1945 so that would put him late 20s. Size is less important than a good actor. Size can be put on watch Road to Perdition and look at Daniel Craig then watch him in Casino Royale. The right actor is key. Captain America has no superhuman powers, although as a result of the Super-Soldier serum and vita-ray treatment, he is transformed from a frail young man into a "perfect" specimen of human development and conditioning. Captain America's strength, endurance, agility, speed, reflexes, durability and healing are at the highest limits of natural human potential. It has been established that Rogers' body regularly replenishes the super-soldier serum; it does not wear off. The formula enhances all of his metabolic functions and prevents the build-up of fatigue poisons in his muscles, giving him endurance far in excess of an ordinary human being. This accounts for many of his extraordinary feats, including bench pressing 1100 pounds (500 kg) and running a mile (1.6 km) in little more than a minute. Furthermore, his enhancements are the reason why he was able to survive being frozen in suspended animation for decades. Rogers is also unable to become intoxicated by alcohol and is immune to many diseases. I guess that would be a healing factor. Kind of the way Wolverine stays young. Edited September 1, 2009 by minimadman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 So Mirymate or anyone else who might know--does the SSS not delay aging at all? The "real" SSS might, but that's not how Steve stayed young. An unexpected side effect of the complete SS process is that Steve goes into suspended animation when his lungs are full of extremely cold water. (They rediscovered this when Cap almost drowned while fighting a ice worm in the arctic circle... you had to read the story...) There are many different people who received variants of the SSS... some have shown greatly slowed aging. Allegedly the Black Widow received the Soviet version of the SSS and it's kept her physically in her prime, despite being shown as a young girl rescued by Cap and Logan during WWII. Isaiah Bradley, a black soldier who received a variant of the SSS in an attempt to perfect/recreate it, is still alive since WWII. Everyone who tried the American SSS without an accompanying vita-ray treatment, which is everyone but Steve, has shown two unusual side effects- greatly increased strength, some reaching superhuman levels, and various degrees of mental degradation. The later usually takes the form of violent mental instability, but in at least one case, it caused brain damage and deterioration. Another well known SSS variant is the "Infinity Formula" given to Nick Fury and many of his Howling Commando lieutenants, which did greatly slow their aging, but as evidence by Dugan, did not grant near physical perfection to anyone taking it. But in Steve's case, he was only a Super Soldier for less than 20 active years of his life, and he's spent some of that time dead. So it's entirely possible that it might, only time will tell if it really slows Cap's aging. (assuming Marvel every lets their heroes age again) And where'ed you get 1917, mmm? Not challenging, but as that's the third date I've come across today, I'm curious where it came from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Thanks for the detailed response, Miry. I also saw that 1917 date, on the Wikipedia page (my 23 number came from their reference to that and Rogers taking the serum in 1940). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I'm sure that in some retelling of the origin they gave 1917 as the date. I got 1922 straight out of a handbook, but given the speed with which things can be retconned it may even officially be 1917 by now. But the overiding point is: 30's is too old for an accurate Cap origin story. The actor at least has to look in his early 20's. Which makes casting a little trickier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buttheadsmate Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 The formula enhances all of his metabolic functions and prevents the build-up of fatigue poisons in his muscles, giving him endurance far in excess of an ordinary human being. This accounts for many of his extraordinary feats, including bench pressing 1100 pounds (500 kg) and running a mile (1.6 km) in little more than a minute. Furthermore, his enhancements are the reason why he was able to survive being frozen in suspended animation for decades. Rogers is also unable to become intoxicated by alcohol and is immune to many diseases. I guess that would be a healing factor. Kind of the way Wolverine stays young. Fascinating.....Cap has extraordinary feet & metal bollocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) Rogers is also unable to become intoxicated by alcohol Pure conjecture there, as Rogers has stated many times he doesn't drink. Steve's father has been described as a chronically out-of-work alcoholic who died while Steve was still a young boy, (some sources say it was Steve's mother that was the drinker, but after doing more digging around, the far more common story is Steve's father was the drunk) so he has no real interest in trying it himself. It's never been specifically stated Cap's never had a beer after a hard mission, but in one notable instance, Clint (Hawkeye at the time) tried to take Steve out for some R&R at a local pool hall. Steve turned down Clint's offer of a beer saying he "never developed a taste for it", citing an alcoholic parent. Which makes sense, if you have a real full blown alcoholic in your family, it tends to make drinking look a LOT less fun. Cap did once essentially get high on crack. He was busting a drug lab in an old warehouse, the place caught fire and Cap inhaled a lot of fumes. (Yeah, yeah, I know, it doesn't work that way, but apparently old Gru, God rest his soul, didn't do much... hands on research on the subject) So Cap ran around high on crack for a few issues. Good times. It's been fun researching this, and hitting various source books and fan sites to try and get a clearer picture of Cap's early life. Thanks for the excuse to do it. Edited September 1, 2009 by Mirymate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimadman Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I have to admit that I never saw this coming. Chris O'Donnell is in final negotiations to play Captian America. Here's the link. I am going to try and stay positive about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrobotC Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 what do you mean?i think hell be good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twisted Two-Face Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 what do you mean?i think hell be good You're right. Because if O'Donnell gets this role that's exactly where this movie is going. To Hell. Seriously, between Reynolds getting Hal and now O'Donnell getting Steve, this year has been awful for role selection. I hated him as Robin. I'm still gonna hate him as Cap. Wait, i take that back. He'd be fine for a FLASHBACK or YOUNG Cap getting the Super Soldier Serum injection and training ,but not as full-on Cap America. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trekker 42 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Oh please dear God in heaven let this be a joke... We cannot let that guy ruin ANOTHER superhero. NOT AGAIN!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I can't believe this. Seems like a horrible, horrible choice if true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimadman Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 what do you mean?i think hell be good Don't get me wrong I don't hate Chris O'Donnell but NEVER in a million years would I think of him when Captain America is mentioned. He has never even turned in a performance that I can look at now to make me feel like he'd be a good Cap. As I said I am going to remain optimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 (edited) As I said I am going to remain optimistic. That makes one of us I'm optimistic that this rumor will not come to pass. If true, I have no hope whatsoever for this movie. --edit: that link never worked for me, and when I go to the home page for that website, I see nothing. It could be that the studio asked them to remove the link because they didn't want the news out yet. . .or, it could be that they found out it was an unsubstantiated rumor. Of course, it could just be a glitch, but I'm doubting it I also see nothing in Variety, which is being referenced in that article when I google it-- Edited October 13, 2009 by karamazov80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimadman Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 As I said I am going to remain optimistic. That makes one of us I'm optimistic that this rumor will not come to pass. If true, I have no hope whatsoever for this movie. --edit: that link never worked for me, and when I go to the home page for that website, I see nothing. It could be that the studio asked them to remove the link because they didn't want the news out yet. . .or, it could be that they found out it was an unsubstantiated rumor. Of course, it could just be a glitch, but I'm doubting it I also see nothing in Variety, which is being referenced in that article when I google it-- The article said essentially that the deal is being finalized and will be announced later this week. I asked Harry Knowles from AICN if he knows anything about it on Twitter and he replied (which I think is kind of cool) that he hopes it is not true and he has not heard anything about it. what do you mean?i think hell be good You're right. Because if O'Donnell gets this role that's exactly where this movie is going. To Hell. Seriously, between Reynolds getting Hal and now O'Donnell getting Steve, this year has been awful for role selection. I hated him as Robin. I'm still gonna hate him as Cap. Wait, i take that back. He'd be fine for a FLASHBACK or YOUNG Cap getting the Super Soldier Serum injection and training ,but not as full-on Cap America. Let it go already. Ryan Reynolds is good casting for Hal Jordan. It's a little odd that you think a 39 year old can play a young Cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 (edited) Chris O'Donnell is in final negotiations to play Captain America. Pro- he's relatively handsome, blondish, blue-eyed, in descent shape, has a certain "all-American" look to him, and his new show is doing well in the ratings. Con- Lacks gravitas. Unless he has some hidden reserve of acting talent I've never seen, I find it nearly impossible for me to see him as Cap. Everything I've seen him in to this point seems to point to him being a more believable Hawkeye. (and unfortunatly my sister-in-law has something of a crush on him, so I've sat through more rom-coms with O'Donnell than should be allowed.) So, is it the worse possible choice... no... they're not talking to Dawson of Creek fame, or anyone from High School Musical... to our knowledge. But there has to be someone better out there. Edited October 13, 2009 by Mirymate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimadman Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Chris O'Donnell is in final negotiations to play Captain America. Pro- he's relatively handsome, blondish, blue-eyed, in descent shape, has a certain "all-American" look to him, and his new show is doing well in the ratings. Con- Lacks gravitas. Unless he has some hidden reserve of acting talent I've never seen, I find it nearly impossible for me to see him as Cap. Everything I've seen him in to this point seems to point to him being a more believable Hawkeye. So, is it the worse possible choice... no... they're not talking to Dawson of Creek fame, or anyone from High School Musical... to our knowledge. But there has to be someone better out there. Very well thought out sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 (edited) Funny now that you bring it up, I think he could make a very decent Hawkeye. Funny because: a ) I don't think he is a very good actor, and b ) Hawkeye might be my favorite Marvel character! But I still think it could work somehow given his cockiness and tinge of insecurity, along with his looks and athleticism. Cap, though? No way. Edited October 13, 2009 by karamazov80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trekker 42 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Well maybe he could pull off the 616 Hawkeye, but if it's the Ultimate Hawkeye, no. The guy I see playing Ultimate Hawkeye, who almost seems more likely for the movie as Hawkeye is a bit similar to Cap from what I've seen in 616 and they need someone who is just balls-out badass and is not Nick Fury for the film, is probably Karl Urban. By virtue of his LOTR he has the balls-out awesome in him. And by virtue of Star Trek, he has the cynical funny. Makeup and physical training does the rest. Anyone think Chris Pine would be good for a 616 Hawkeye? He's got the cocky and the badass mixed into a little ball of awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I do think Chris Pine could do Hawkeye well. I don't know anything about the Ultimates version, personally. I know he supposedly uses guns or something. WTF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Hawkeye is my favorite character not just at Marvel, but all around as well. Based on his Kirk performance, Pine could play Hawkeye easily. And yeah, Ult Hawkeye uses guns and dresses like he's from the Wildstorm universe. Of course, 616 has Clint using swords and dressed like Mortal Kombat ninja, so what you gonna do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trekker 42 Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 Well now, some more details of Captain America have started to crawl from the woodworks: Joe Johnston confirms The Invaders being in the entire second half of the movie. And there will be six. Namor, Cap, Bucky, Union Jack, Torch, Toro. Yeah. I'm excited. And the fact that they are including these characters sets up PERFECTLY for an Atlantean Invasion for the Avengers to tackle when Namor gets just pissed with the surface world. Which would make for one hell of a fight. Also Red Skull is definately the villain. No question. Source: http://movies.ign.com/articles/106/1067382p1.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karamazov80 Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 (edited) Well, I've recently been involved elsewhere in a spirited debate over this film, and was curious to see the thoughts of MMMV members. Here is a recently interview by director Joe Johnston: http://www.superherohype.com/news/captaina...ews.php?id=8985 Important snippets that I noticed: "It's the origin story of Captain America. It's mostly period—there are modern, present-day bookends on it—but it's basically the story of how Steve Rogers becomes Captain America. The great thing about Captain America is he's a super hero without any super powers. Which is why this story, among the hundreds of superhero stories, appealed to me the most." "But at the heart of it, it's a story about this kid, who all he wants to do is fit in. This thing happens and he still doesn't fit in. And he has to prove himself a hero—essentially go AWOL to save a friend." In my opinion, this is not great news. I understand the need to see Cap in WWII, but to me, what makes him special isn't that he is just a "super hero without super powers" who fought in WWII (even though I would argue that he technically does have super powers since he's unnaturally faster and stronger than everyone else--Batman has no super powers). Rather, what makes him a different kind of character is that he is an anachronism--a man out of time. His value system was forged squarely during the lead-up to World War II, but he lives in the modern day, with all that that entails. This underscores every thing that he does and thinks in his solo comic and is so critically important to Cap as modern comic readers know him (where essentially his first ever appearance was Avengers #4), that Cap isn't Cap unless he is this man who doesn't belong. To do his origin as an entire movie where you basically ignore this part of him is, to me, akin to doing a an X-Men story prior to any anti-mutant hysteria. I realize that the Avengers movie and potential sequels can further explore this part of Cap, but it is so important to who he is, that I personally think it would be a real shame to leave it out of the first film. Another problem I have is that the director thinks of Cap as a kid who just wants to fit in. WTF is that about? When has Cap just wanted to fit in? Anyway, though that interview is very short, I think it is quite telling, and what it says is a bit concerning to me. I get the impression that the director isn't all that familiar with Cap, and is taking some surface level characteristics (fought in WWII, basic history, basic costume, etc.) and goes from there. If the motivations and major components of the character are off, then I worry where that leads. It could still be a good movie of course, but will it really be about Cap? Any other thoughts? --edit: to Trekker's post, my understanding is that Fox owns the rights to do use Namor, as that came with the rights to the Fantastic Four films. So, not sure how the Invaders angle might come to pass. Personally, I wish they would do a Cap movie exclusively about Cap. You are gonna get the team-up with the Avengers. Isn't he a character worth exploring on his own merits without teaming him up with a bunch of other super-powered freaks?-- Edited February 10, 2010 by karamazov80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minimadman Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 as far as the fitting in remark I took it to mean that all Steve Rogers wanted was to be like everyone else and take up arms to fight for his country. I am giving Joe Johnston a pass until I see the movie. I think that he is the right guy for the job and has a great style that will serve the movie well so it all rests on the shoulders of the story that, truth be told, has not really been revealed to us yet all we have is some out of context information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirymate Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 Starting Cap in WWII is important in that unless you ground him in that era, then it lessens the anachronism angle. You need to be see him play the hero in WWII, need to watch him become a confident leader of men and a living legend of that era. That way, when he is for whatever reason lost, and recovered by the Avengers decades later, it will carry more weight. And it grounds the Red Skull as an actual death dealing Nazi, not a modern wannabe. (cause you know somehow he'll show up in the present too) And technically, Cap doesn't have "super-powers". He is suppossed to be as physically perfect and powerful as a human can be without being considered superhuman. Blurry frellin' line if you ask me, but except for a breif period in the 70's Cap's abilities were not superhuman. That's not to say I'm 100% on board with the director's statements. But I can sort of see the board strokes of where he's headed and it could work. Casting on this one is going to be key. And I'm not sure Namor was included with the FF rights deal, as a separate Namor movie has been kicked around for a long time. That said I'm not sure that including him and Torch in a Cap movie is a good idea. Both would need a lot of explination and exposition on their own, and that's gonna take focus off Cap. As much as I am loath to retconn things for movies sake, I think a lower-powered Invaders squad, with guys like Union Jack might be less... distracting for lack of a better word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthRaider Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 I've heard a rumor about how they're planning to make his red, white and blue costume mesh with the supposedly "serious" treatment of the film: they give him the Super Soldier treatment, but rather than send him to the frontlines they just make him a performer/mascot/propaganda piece for the USO or something. That might explain the "wants to be just like everyone else" angle. Anybody care to comment on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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