What's next for the High Evolutionary?

[buttheadsmate]

I'm a complicated soul when it comes to Minimates.... I love them yet I'm perhaps amongst the most critical of them . I often fail to see the beauty of certain characters because they might be missing that certain something that makes a good Minimate great. The first Hulk Minimate,for example, was always amongst my love/hate characters ,perfect when it was released yet irritatingly small in so many ways as the years passed. What happened next with that particular Minimate is well-documented here & mainly involves a lot of hand-wringing & wailing about extensions & pedal extremities . Less attention always seems to have been paid to the Hulk's arms .....an area so obvious to the character that it baffled me why nothing was done in this area for so many years. I shan't continue to drag up past faux pas because if I didn't like it I would have said so at the time.....I'm far more interested in what's happening now........ hence the thread.

Are we all up to speed on the changes that have taken place over these first 10 years of Minimates ??

If not then keep reading because you may find it as interesting I do.

Whether we like it or not Minimates evolved from the kubrick idea .....at least that's what Digger said & he should know. Kubricks have less articulation.... having no knees or elbows.... & are larger, they should however, in nearly every other respect, be classed as a 'different animal'. One thing that both Minimates & kubricks share is the hand design & this is the one area that is becoming a tad annoying ,at least to me. Some of the latest, most superb, Minimates that we are seeing now have fantastic detail & clams where their hands ought to be. It can't just be me that's fighting the 'purity' issue here because many characters (Thing,Hulk again) are gaining digits ....making them amongst the most remarkable 'mates ever.

So......how many people want more Minimates with hands......er.....hands up?

My guess is that were going to get far more sculpted hands across the lines as the Battle Beast (BB) line evolves.

Holes in the head .....why? It must be a production thing ....it has to be because I can think of no reason to have them otherwise. Of course certain 'mates should have them but they should be rarities rather than the norm because if you cut the peg off of nigh on any hairpiece it will still remain quite snugly on a Minimate head. Conversely the pegged hairpiece needs to be trimmed off to universally fit holeless heads ......so why have them ?

Moulded heads ? Anybody who got their sweaty mitts on the first 'gator BB promo must got some inkling ,as I did, that something dramatic was going to have to happen with future BB efforts if the Minimate line was going to keep its integrity.

Real Ghostbusters came out & the neighbourhood was well & truly gone .....I bit my tongue,smiled & ....yeah....shook my head.

Moulded heads were of necessity the only way to go & I'd bet my last dollar that Chuck was the man that needed convincing...I don't profess to know him well but from the conversations I've had with him he is (was?) very conservative with his own idea of Minimate evolution.

So I'll stop there ....2 finger typing with my 2 clams is tiring...& ask how you see Minimates evolving from now on?

[youbastards]

When you say hands, the first thing that jumps to my mind is the hands on the Terminator endoskeleton, is that what you have in mind? Personally, I was never a fan of those, mostly because they look out of scale.

I guess I am fine with the current design, but what I would prefer is more uniquely molded hands, ie: Spidey thwips, Dr Strange casting a spell, Shang-Chi kung fu chop, etc. How much more awesome would the new movie Hawkeye have been if he came with another hand molded holding an arrow ready to fire?

Removing the hole in the head is fine with me, as long as the hair stays on, unlike most of the first few waves where it never stayed on.

Edited May 10, 2012 by youbastards

[MiniFiend UK]

The peg hole head in mates that dont have hair is a pet hate of mine. There is no need sometimes and it gets my goat!

[hellpop]

I personally hope we don't see more in the way of sculpted heads. I've never liked them much, but I'll accept them for characters that have truly unique heads, like the GB ghosts and Battle Beasts. But for humans? No, no, a thousand times no! I'll never forget opening the Silence of the Lambs set and being deeply disappointed that those figures had (what I consider to be) ugly sculpted heads.

What I like now is the feeling that DST can make just about any character into a Minimate. We've gotten Lockjaw, and we're getting Modok, and I see no reason why we won't eventually get Rocket Raccoon. That's what I think is next: more truly unique characters and designs. The design team's gotten very creative with that basic Minimate body, which has proven to be very functional, and I suspect they will continue to challenge themselves in great new ways.

[TM2 Dinobot]

You know my stance. I like the simplicity best. So I'm always going to vote against molded parts.

[Jeff]

I'm the opposite. I loved the molded heads/bodys. Certain characters like the Boogie Man wouldn't have looked right otherwise (although he's the most extreme minimate I've seen). Yes, it would have been a Boogie Man minimate, but would have looked awful with a normal sized head and legs. Same goes for TMNT if ever made, would have to have molded heads and shells. Animal and robot characters can break the standard minimate body mold for me- but not humans.

What would I like to see next? Build a figure would be neat or more sculpted chairs and wall displays. Luke's got it right with his new flight bases and capes. I swear he secretly works for DST. If not, they should hire him. When a fan can produce more creative product than the company itself, it's time to rethink the line. I love the selection of characters from DST but they really are limiting their potential, in my opinion.

[groundhog7s]

I'm for whatever keeps the product moving. I don't think Minimates would be where they are today if they didn't change. And if you're going for purity, I think you have to go back to the 3" days if you're going to be a purist. I think the change to 2" figures was huge compared to just sculpted hands. I think that sums up my thinking-change is inevitable to survive and I'm cool with it.

I'll agree with yb that hands in sculpted poses makes a lot of sense and can easily give some figures new life. And I'll also say I hate figures with pegs in the heads with no hair. Last time I checked, I didn't need a huge whole in my head to wear a wig. I'm also a little miffed when a figure has no tampo on the bald head with no hole in it (ie, the new Nick Fury). i understand the need to skip that step, but it still doesn't look right.

It'll be weird if this conversation can be had in another ten years.

[Lobsterman]

I think they've generally struck the right balance between sculpted pieces and block figures. I don't mind the "clamp" hands, but I also wouldn't mind action-specific sculpted hands (spellcasting, kung fu, as have been mentioned). I think more sculpted add-ons like heads and torsos are fine to a degree, especially when a fun character like Lockjaw or MODOK couldn't be achieved any other way.

That said, I have to admit Battle Beasts worry me a bit. They follow a logical progression from Halo and Real Ghostbusters, in which more and more of the base body pieces (as opposed to add-ons) are being sculpted, when a similar result could be achieved with tampos and/or less structural modification, staying true to the block figure spirit of Minimates. This direction seems to be pushing the line away from being a block figure platform and more towards simply being 2" scale action figures.

It may seem like splitting hairs (of course Minimates are 2" action figures!) but I think the platform aspect is what makes Minimates superior to most other toylines. Consider a Marvel Universe specimen as a typical action figure: it's fun, generally well-sculpted, and capture the essence of the character it portrays, but at the end of the day, it is only that character and cannot be anything else. A lot of the fun of Minimates, on the other hand, is that they can be recombined and reimagined as desired, like LEGO or my long lost love, Xevoz. They represent an interchangeable figure format, rather than a static what-you-see-is-what-you-get figure line – e.g. Biker Gang Spidey or Ghostbuster Superman. In addition, you can gain a huge degree of satisfaction by customizing your own characters with relative ease – some paint or decals on the base body is a lot easier to do than the extensive sculpting needed to customize traditional action figure lines. While not impossible, it's going to be much more difficult, and present a higher barrier to entry, to create custom Battle Beasts – customs will become a project, not a quick pop-together-some-pieces-in-10-minutes affair.

So, I guess I'm not necessarily for the simplicity of Minimates as much as the modularity, and I can imagine the line losing a lot of that modularity as we progress down the road of having more character-specific sculpted structural pieces.

[buttheadsmate]

It'll be weird if this conversation can be had in another ten years.

"Is that you buttdeadsmate?"

The design team's gotten very creative with that basic Minimate body, which has proven to be very functional, and I suspect they will continue to challenge themselves in great new ways.

Well said. An area of deign that has massively improved is the female form which is there for all to see in the much-ignored Femmes Fatales (FF) line..... compare those sexy little ladies with a heavy-hipped broad like MJ from the Spider-Man movie wave If you need an arse for your She-Blob she's your donor..... The FF 'mates are superb .

[karamazov80]

I do like the classic, core Minimate design, and hope that DST can retain a focus on that design despite the "evolution" of Minimates that we continue to witness. But I can also appreciate sculpted parts when it is necessary or beneficial to the aesthetic or functional aspects of a Minimate. Hands. . .I'm not sure. If they could do decent hands for regular humans at that size that allowed for 'Mates to hold weapons, etc., then I might be for it. But if it meant three fingers, or if it looked ugly somehow, then I wouldn't. I don't have a problem with "clam" hands, but I'm not sure that it is an essential component to the "core" Minimate.

[pawcanada]

I've personally never got that "if it's sculpted it's not a minimate" opinion. As long as I can take it apart and the figure has the minimate parts, i.e. square block for the chest, cylinder arms (if necessary), rectangle legs (if necessary), T for the waist and the head piece (if necessary) and it is roughly 2 inches tall, it doesn't matter what is added on to bulk it out or give it armour or a unique body or whatever.

[boyd]

I love the original waves of Minimates and their simple style. But at this point, there's no going back. Sculpted parts give too many options and allow for characters like Lockjaw to happen.

The challenge is (and always has been) to find the balance between preserving the blocky, stylized form of the Minimate with the sculpted pieces. Sometimes it works (the Terror Dogs, Creature from the Black Lagoon), sometimes it doesn't (sculpted fingers & toes, the Boogie Man - sorry, Jeff). And I wish I could say where the balance is, but it's a flexible line at best - you'll know if a Minimate has gone too far once you see it. The only thing I can say is less is always better.

[youbastards]

I'll agree with yb that hands in sculpted poses makes a lot of sense and can easily give some figures new life.

I just want to clarify that the only sculpted hands I want to see going forward are the more realistic kind, ala the new Hulk hands:

The "balled-up Minimate fist" hand that they initially went with didn't do anything for me at all. I appreciate the attempt of "What would a Minimate hand look like as a fist?", but it just didn't work, IMHO.

Yeah, I think I am fine with the "clam/clamp" hands as the default, but I definitely would love to see some new scuplts for specific things when needed. Movie Hawkeye really points out how limited the MM body is when it comes to arm/hand pose-ability, and some custom hand sculpting would easily remedy that.

[karamazov80]

And I wish I could say where the balance is, but it's a flexible line at best - you'll know if a Minimate has gone too far once you see it.

I'm not sure if I agree with this, simply because AA/DST has kept changing the bar so much that I think our expectations have shifted pretty substantially (albeit slowly) over time. What we think is "a Minimate" today may not be the same as what we accept as one in five years.

[boyd]

I'm not sure if I agree with this, simply because AA/DST has kept changing the bar so much that I think our expectations have shifted pretty substantially (albeit slowly) over time. What we think is "a Minimate" today may not be the same as what we accept as one in five years.

This is true - I remember when Salaak came out, and there was a great deal of debate about the sculpted head and unique body. Now if he were released today, I don't anyone would get upset.

[Jeff]

I love the original waves of Minimates and their simple style. But at this point, there's no going back. Sculpted parts give too many options and allow for characters like Lockjaw to happen.

The challenge is (and always has been) to find the balance between preserving the blocky, stylized form of the Minimate with the sculpted pieces. Sometimes it works (the Terror Dogs, Creature from the Black Lagoon), sometimes it doesn't (sculpted fingers & toes, the Boogie Man - sorry, Jeff). And I wish I could say where the balance is, but it's a flexible line at best - you'll know if a Minimate has gone too far once you see it. The only thing I can say is less is always better.

No worries boyd. I was just happy that a Boogieman figure saw the light of day, let alone real ghostbuster minimates. They were my Kang.

[khonshu knight]

I love how they're changed over time. Bulking up big characters, molded heads, better use of the cape, and "rounder" bodies are just a start. Personally I wish their hands were compatible with other smaller figures, keep the hand style on regular 'mates but enlarge the round hole in the center to fit other things and hot worry about having the hand permanently stick in an open position.

Also I've noticed the matte white plastic tends to get dirty way faster than other plastics.

[hellpop]

It may seem like splitting hairs (of course Minimates are 2" action figures!) but I think the platform aspect is what makes Minimates superior to most other toylines. Consider a Marvel Universe specimen as a typical action figure: it's fun, generally well-sculpted, and capture the essence of the character it portrays, but at the end of the day, it is only that character and cannot be anything else. A lot of the fun of Minimates, on the other hand, is that they can be recombined and reimagined as desired, like LEGO or my long lost love, Xevoz. They represent an interchangeable figure format, rather than a static what-you-see-is-what-you-get figure line – e.g. Biker Gang Spidey or Ghostbuster Superman. In addition, you can gain a huge degree of satisfaction by customizing your own characters with relative ease – some paint or decals on the base body is a lot easier to do than the extensive sculpting needed to customize traditional action figure lines. While not impossible, it's going to be much more difficult, and present a higher barrier to entry, to create custom Battle Beasts – customs will become a project, not a quick pop-together-some-pieces-in-10-minutes affair.

So, I guess I'm not necessarily for the simplicity of Minimates as much as the modularity, and I can imagine the line losing a lot of that modularity as we progress down the road of having more character-specific sculpted structural pieces.

Oh, I agree. I think that's one of the great things about 'mates, and why I like all the sculpted pieces. I really thought playing up the interchangeability with the MAX line was a great idea.

One thing I wonder, though: have Minimates gone as far as they can as just figures? To reach the next stage (IE going from a niche collectible to a mainstream toy product) do they need to revisit the C3 concept. And do we, or DST, want that to happen?

[Pete]

Correct me if I'm wrong... but didn't Uncanny X-Force Angel's prototype image show silver claws, despite the fact that he came with the normal hand.

That's what I would like to see, rather than fingers... the suggestion of fingers.

In fact, I thing movie Sabretooth has these too?

I would like to see small grooves within the 'ball' type hand... that would be the ideal middle ground for me.

What next though... sculpted boobs... male nipples?

[buttheadsmate]

Noses......? Sometimes they need to be incorporated in the design IMO . The 'Batman Returns' Penguin & penguin are two of the best kubricks ever produced .......... I'm not suggesting that they need to be the norm but they're occasional use would add that certain something to particular characters.

Check out the fingers on 'Lounge Lizard' (centre)......

[Cappy]

As often happens, I find myself quoting Lobsterman:

I think they've generally struck the right balance between sculpted pieces and block figures. I don't mind the "clamp" hands, but I also wouldn't mind action-specific sculpted hands (spellcasting, kung fu, as have been mentioned).

Iron Man has been gifted with a couple hand styles that are uniquely sculpted, but still say "Minimate". The folks at DST can get a lot into the clam hands and I see no need to stray too far from that.

But then, I've been a fan of simplicity from way back. My favorite 'Mates are the blanks! heh

That being said, I've been buying up all of Halo and will dive deeply into Battle Beasts. I can live with this because those lines just feel different: they started out as sculpted figures and, to me, are really just 2" action figures, not block figures.

As this thread is about the evolution of Minimates, I will prophesize that sculpted 'Mates are the way of the future. DST sees too much potential in this format and the new kids don't seem to mind it. I just wish that lines which started as block figures, like Marvel, would stay that way. So may original Spider-Man will still look standing next to 10th Anniversary Spidey.

In addition, you can gain a huge degree of satisfaction by customizing your own characters with relative ease – some paint or decals on the base body is a lot easier to do than the extensive sculpting needed to customize traditional action figure lines. While not impossible, it's going to be much more difficult, and present a higher barrier to entry, to create custom Battle Beasts – customs will become a project, not a quick pop-together-some-pieces-in-10-minutes affair...I can imagine the line losing a lot of that modularity as we progress down the road of having more character-specific sculpted structural pieces.

And herein lies another danger to the evolving sculpted look of the 'Mates. The new lines have not only lost their block figure status, but are not longer quick custom fodder.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Cappy

[MinnesotaIceman]

The peg hole head in mates that dont have hair is a pet hate of mine. There is no need sometimes and it gets my goat!

This.

[Jatta Pake]

I think DST has a threshold they won't go over in terms of core body piece sculpting. Like a head or thigh or hand or shoulder is ok but not every piece. I'm still trying to wrap my head around the new crotch piece in Hulk.

75% of the figure needs to remain a basic 'mate or it stops being one. I would be intrigued by a highly articulated 2" line like mini marvel universe figures. MiniSelects would be real cool.

[MrClean]

1336674652[/url]' post='225027']

Correct me if I'm wrong... but didn't Uncanny X-Force Angel's prototype image show silver claws, despite the fact that he came with the normal hand.

That's what I would like to see, rather than fingers... the suggestion of fingers.

In fact, I thing movie Sabretooth has these too?

I would like to see small grooves within the 'ball' type hand... that would be the ideal middle ground for me.

What next though... sculpted boobs... male nipples?

I had to check mine, but my X-Force Archangel has the silver claw hands. And yes, movie Sabertooth has them too., as well as Marvel Zombies (I think).

[Mirymate]

I don't know... the evolution of minimates has been slowly leading to where we are now. It started way back in Wave 2, when the Green Goblin got pointy toed boots and Carnage got pointy clawed fingers. Now we've got dog creatures, six armed Spidey's, and minimates in forms no one could have imagined in 2002. If I had to guess the next step, I'd say a greater range on non-human forms. IIRC Chuck/Zach said that they had kinda worked out how to do Shuma for MvC3, which is just all kinds of crazy town to me. But that's where I think we're heading now.

On fingers, the Mandarin came with fingered hands with his rings on them. I found I didn't mind the fingers on that mate, and I guess I wouldn't mind them. I don't know. Truely hadn't given them much thought before this thread.

Head holes bother me when they aren't needed to keep the hair/hat on.