Diamond Declares Bankrupcy

[Padrino]

On 8/2/2026 at 3:32 AM, buttheadsmate said:

My wording was unintentionally accurate .  Having now trawled through a few internet articles ...3D trademarks,shape protection ,copyright , Lego law-suits ...it becomes fairly clear that (in a nutshell) block figures can be similar but not identical .  Essentially any new block figure manufacturer would need a good attorney .  Palz & kubricks, for example, were similar to Minimates yet way way different , bigger &/or less articulate .                                                                                           

Barry's opinion has infinitely more weight than mine & he can see the mountain that might have to be climbed to bring back Minimates to where they once were .  My view is simplistic perhaps naive but I genuinely think that someone should take a shot at just approaching "the new entity " & just ask them WTF they are up to . 

Find the mountain first then climb it . 

fortune favors the bold

[Barry]

On 8/2/2026 at 3:32 AM, buttheadsmate said:

Barry's opinion has infinitely more weight than mine & he can see the mountain that might have to be climbed to bring back Minimates to where they once were .  My view is simplistic perhaps naive but I genuinely think that someone should take a shot at just approaching "the new entity " & just ask them WTF they are up to . 

There's a lot of factors involved with the tooling as mentioned, but something people may not realize is just how much the retail and collectibles landscape has changed.

When Minimates were in what I would consider their prime (circa 2012-2013), it was a very different world. Production costs were significantly lower, Toys R Us was still in existence and was a major force, Walgreens actively supported collector products, the MCU was just beginning its rise, Amazon was nowhere near as dominant as it is today, online retailers were still secondary to specialty stores, preorder culture had not yet become the norm, and the kids' market remained incredibly important.

Almost all of that has changed. A single Minimate would likely retail for close to $10 today, and the 'close' might even be on the higher side of 10. Toys R Us was a huge supporter of the line selling to both kids and collectors, while Walgreens had become a destination for collectors and often partnered for exclusives. Amazon and preorder culture reshaped the market, retailers reorganized their priorities,.  Amazon generally has little interest in low price niche collectibles, and Wal-Mart dictates what price they need your product to be, or you don't get sold there at all.

It was probably a perfect storm of circumstances that would be difficult to recreate. I wouldn't call it lightning in a bottle since it took nearly a decade for the line to reach its peak but the scale of the brand around that time was remarkable. At that point, I was designing, coloring, or preparing tampo pretty much for more than one Minimate per calendar day. Once you take our weekends and holidays, it was a LOT of work going on.  I don't have sales data for it, but I'm sure the financial crisis in 2008 added to sales, believe it or not.  It's called the lipstick effect: consumers tend to buy cheap items to make themselves happy in times of downturn instead of big luxury items.  We might've just been that right hit of purchasing pleasure in that market, making kids (and collectors) happy, giving them that new toy at an affordable price.  

Well before the bankruptcy, and before the TRU's as well, the numbers were already slowing. From 2015 to 2016 alone, the number of figures I worked on dropped by roughly 100 in a single year. After TRU filed for protection, another hundred figures were dropped.

I'm not saying they couldn't return but they would have to become a very different kind of business, and it's not one that I think the costs would be able to handle.  The old model of convincing TRU to stock six waves a year with hopes that they sold through simply doesn't exist anymore.  Robert and I often discussed alternatives like subscription services, crowdfunding campaigns, design driven preorders... For a brief moment, we almost had a partnership with Eaglemoss for a magazine-service like their die-cast vehicle a month offers.  There's probably ideas that could work, but I don't think the market exists anymore for sales in the tens of thousands of units.  

Tooling costs were very high, and paint and deco prices can be astronomical.  I don't even think some companies understand that now, based on the kitchen-sink approaches to design and the retail prices they are at now.  I was constantly trying to trim deco where I could, and was thinking of more ways we could reduce.  I know it was a sore spot for long-time collectors who were accustomed to full-leg tampo wrapped Spidey-webbing, but it was cut where possible or suffer higher prices.  Even at the end, people balked at the 6pk concept for a all-in-one wave.  The new price for those was the same as three 2pks would have had to have been, there was no premium box price despite what people wanted to believe, (cardboard is cardboard, even if there's just a bit more of it), but people didn't want to pay it.  It's the classic retail mentality of $9.99 isn't $10 in a LOT of people's eyes, ask them quickly and the majority would say the items is $9.  Three times a smaller price looks lower than the actual total of those three items in one price.  I don't think people will want a single 2" toy at $10, but maybe I'm wrong.

[Barry]

I may have posted this before, but if not, just for some potential insight, this is the breakdown of how many figures I worked on per year.  I only began in November of 2006, and 2007's first half would be skewed because I wasn't full time,  (that began in May 2007) but after that I worked on every single Minimate, if not the actual design, then design elements.  It was still 100% of the colour and tampo.  So, the numbers aren't lower because I wasn't assigned something, as I worked on everything in some capacity.

2006 - 11

2007 - 137

2008 - 214

2009 - 297

2010 - 365

2011 - 279

2012 - 366

2013 - 368

2014 - 274

2015 - 358

2016 - 254

2017 - 221

2018 - 163

2019 - 53

2020 - 57

2021 - 28

2022 - 80

2023 - 38

2024 - 44

TOTAL - 3607

Edited August 4 by Barry

[buttheadsmate]

I'm Gobsmacked by the amount of figures that you have worked on .I'm grateful to you & I'm proud to own every Minimate /Vinimate that became available . 

Regards the pricing of Minimates I have always bitten my tongue (idiom ) on this forum as I wouldn't have endeared myself with my fellow-collectors by saying " I have always  thought that they were too cheap ". I'm no genius but the retail selling price rarely seemed to make sense .   

[Liney]

1 hour ago, buttheadsmate said:

Regards the pricing of Minimates I have always bitten my tongue (idiom ) on this forum as I wouldn't have endeared myself with my fellow-collectors by saying " I have always  thought that they were too cheap ". I'm no genius but the retail selling price rarely seemed to make sense .   

Pricing for me is difficult, as I'm so out of touch.

I think Invaders was the last set I bought at retail - I think it was around £30, and two packs were £7.99. 

Then I never saw any other sets until Walking Dead, which weren't my thing, or NBX which I only saw on clearance. 

So in my head they are still about £4-5 a mate... even when buying in the secondary market

Edited August 4 by Liney

[Barry]

1 hour ago, buttheadsmate said:

I'm Gobsmacked by the amount of figures that you have worked on .I'm grateful to you & I'm proud to own every Minimate /Vinimate that became available . 

Regards the pricing of Minimates I have always bitten my tongue (idiom ) on this forum as I wouldn't have endeared myself with my fellow-collectors by saying " I have always  thought that they were too cheap ". I'm no genius but the retail selling price rarely seemed to make sense .   

Thank you kindly!  I appreciate that.

I always thought the price was reasonable, but I know a lot of people think things should be cheap.  It always amuses (maybe angers, sometimes?) me when people think that the people behind products are getting stinking rich off the prices.  They always think that anything plastic costs five cents regardless, and therefore everything else charged to the consumer is pure profit.  Minimates might be more expensive to make than people think.  I don't feel that I should disclose it, but I don't know why.  One figure is ineed NOT 5 cents, let's just say that.  There's creative (my end, design, etc), factory labour costs, material costs, deco, shipping, prototyping, more shipping, licensor fees, retail markup, MORE shipping...  the list goes on.  So, I agree with you, they probably could have cost more honestly, and maybe some of us wouldn't be rich, but maybe would have a very slight, marginally increased salary for all the efforts and long hours. 

 

25 minutes ago, Liney said:

Pricing for me is difficult, as I'm so out of touch.

I think Invaders was the last set I bought at retail - I think it was around £30, and two packs were £7.99. 

Then I never saw any until Walking Dead, which weren't my thing, or NBX which I only saw on clearance. 

So in my head they are still about £4-5 a mate... even when buying in tbe secondary market

So, last I remember they were $8.99 for a 2pk, USD?  (People correct me if I'm wrong).  Most toylines have gone up 25%-35% since 2020, so that could anywhere from $11.49 to $12.49 now.  Maybe even more, because no one uses .49 pricing now.  Different things go up at different rates too.  I know licencing fees were shooting up drastically 5 years ago, which could really hurt things.

[buttheadsmate]

The effort that must have gone into producing several memorable Minimates is obvious but I find it is so ironic that for every (elaborate Minimate) Hulkbuster there is a (simple Minimate) AIM agent .   Perhaps Barry might argue that "Bill" was not so simple but .....       They both had a similar retail 2pk. price  , I accept that . 

[Liney]

55 minutes ago, Barry said:

So, last I remember they were $8.99 for a 2pk, USD?  (People correct me if I'm wrong).  Most toylines have gone up 25%-35% since 2020, so that could anywhere from $11.49 to $12.49 now. 

I stuck the price and year into an inflation calculator which tells me that £7.99 in 2007 would be £13.91 today. So nearly double in 20 years isn't too crazy

[Barry]

Haha, they do all balance out in the end.  Some were definitely more cost than others, but we averaged and amortized.

Just on my end, for instance, early on I was charging a lot more for a Hulkbuster than an AIM Agent, but it was getting confusing.  People were questioning just how much something was worth, how much time was spent on something.  Sometimes an armoured character, like the MCU Iron Man MkIII who went through 1 iteration with a couple of minor tweaks, actually took less time than something seemingly simple, like 90's Jim Lee Storm who went through 17 iterations of her cape. 

So, in the end, I proposed one design cost, one colour cost, one tampo cost.  Sometimes I would lose, sometimes they would lose.  For every recolour I could earn full pay on that took me literally 5 minutes to complete there was a design that took weeks of refinements.  Everyone agreed that was the best way to handle it so we didn't have to debate every invoice.

[SCW]

Couple random thoughts to chime in here, just food for thought.

I was at Target today and saw the new Playmates TMNT Launcherz mini figures and it immediately made me think of Minimates. They were similar scale, though I don't know if exact. They look to only have 2 or 3 POA but the toys are designed to be "launched" via some sort of included apparatus that I couldn't really discern but looks like an oversized Cheapskate vehicle. Anyway, two thoughts occurred to me.

1. I wish the TMNT Minimates had looked a bit more like this (not to bash the work Barry or anyone else did on them and I grew to love the Minimates TMNT design, but I liked these rounded heads and details) and I wish these were more articulate so they could go with my Mates.

2. These things were $10.99 for 1 figure and a "vehicle" gimmick launcher thing, which felt like a lot given there were no other accessories or anything. And this was from Playmates who are notorious if nothing else from being able to pack a lot of value into a cheap price.

What does it all mean? Nothing much, but I suspect given what was produced there and the price point, I could see Minimates being $10-$12 for a 2 pack if they were released today. Which would probably still feel like a value when most figures (not all) are $15+.

Jazwares has been able to keep prices down and while they might not have as much deco as some MMs, their Stranger Things 85 line retails for $10-$12 (depending on the retailer) and are fully sculpted (no reuse) and fully articulated. I think MM could be a reasonable price for today's market.

But given the costs and such, profit margin would probably be slim.

Anyway, someone should bring back Minimates...

 

ALSO COMPLETELY UNRELATED...

Did DST ever look into Venture Brothers? Would have made great MMs.

[Barry]

I have never seen those Launcherz, they really do look like Minimates, down to the old Hulk duck-feet, lol!  I'm not insulted, they do feel like they fit the Minimate style this way. But yeah, I could see that 2026 Minimates might be around that price.  I think maybe a dollar or so more for the added deco though.

Don't get me started on Venture Brothers, trust me, I asked and asked!  Diamond wasn't interested, and I don't think the creators were interested much either.  On one of the DVD commentaries, they said something to the effect that the only reason why they let the clothed figures happen was because they grew up with Mego figures.  Otherwise, there would be no toys.  They wanted what they would like to play with, and they didn't like modern collectibles.  I'm paraphrasing here, but it sounded like there was no chance for the licencing of it. 

I know Bif Bang Pow finally convinced someone to allow 3 3/4 figures, but the line didn't go far.  Somehow there was a couple of Sideshow statues too, but those didn't help my cause arguing for more collectibles because those were in their weekly sale emails for ages.  In any case, I personally really wanted them, but I never saw them on any WB licencing list.

It could just be one of those "huge fandom that doesn't want product" things.  This happens a lot more with fans of a certain age, as 'kids' (like, late 20s to 30-somes now) didn't grow up with figures the way 45 to 50 year olds did.

 

[SCW]

3 minutes ago, Barry said:

Don't get me started on Venture Brothers, trust me, I asked and asked!  Diamond wasn't interested, and I don't think the creators were interested much either.  On one of the DVD commentaries, they said something to the effect that the only reason why they let the clothed figures happen was because they grew up with Mego figures.  Otherwise, there would be no toys.  They wanted what they would like to play with, and they didn't like modern collectibles.  I'm paraphrasing here, but it sounded like there was no chance for the licencing of it. 

I know Bif Bang Pow finally convinced someone to allow 3 3/4 figures, but the line didn't go far.  Somehow there was a couple of Sideshow statues too, but those didn't help my cause arguing for more collectibles because those were in their weekly sale emails for ages.  In any case, I personally really wanted them, but I never saw them on any WB licencing list.

It could just be one of those "huge fandom that doesn't want product" things.  This happens a lot more with fans of a certain age, as 'kids' (like, late 20s to 30-somes now) didn't grow up with figures the way 45 to 50 year olds did.

 

Appreciate the insights!

 

As for VB: Yeah the creators definitely were adverse to it (and kinda combative in general at times) and they did want the Mego figures explicitly because they were clunky. Which I don't think is what BBP wanted and they consistently pivoted to making really solid VB figures in that style (with some clunk that just comes with the format) and then they made kinda clunky 3 3/4 figures (which I think was just more of BBP not being the most capable manufacturer not intentional clunk) but yeah, I been rewatching some VB and it feels ripe for some MMs.

I do think there was a demand for more modern figures, at least at the height of VBs popularity, because I recall a LOT of people complaining about the lack of "good" figures back then. Of course I'm not sure they would have considered MMs "good" either. Feels like DST could have gotten some juice out of it in a couple of formats though. But in my mind's eye I can picture a huge cast of characters in MM style.

On that note I don't think Adult Swim or whatever WB arm ran that thing, ever had much interest in merchandising anything with toys, which I'll never quite understand. Many of those shows were super popular at times and outside of a couple vinyl pieces here or there and the very early Palisades stuff, very few if any AS shows got toys. Honestly a lot of CN shows in general didn't get a lot of toys, which again, is odd when you consider the numbers a lot of those shows did.

 

[buttheadsmate]

What would be the obstacles involved in producing a range of Minimate-compatible accessories ?  I'm specifically thinking about headgear/ hats etc. , capes, wings , masks , hands , custom body-parts ,bulked-biceps etc. etc.  I'm emphatically dismissing the need for any standard Minimate body parts .  One piece of injection-mould-tooling for all of these parts & maybe produce it with no tampo-printing if this becomes cost prohibitive .  All of this might infringe 'whatever ' but I can't see the need for any specific licensing costs ?  I'm not sure whether top-end 3D printing would be an alternative to moulding ?  

 

[Barry]

15 hours ago, SCW said:

On that note I don't think Adult Swim or whatever WB arm ran that thing, ever had much interest in merchandising anything with toys, which I'll never quite understand. Many of those shows were super popular at times and outside of a couple vinyl pieces here or there and the very early Palisades stuff, very few if any AS shows got toys. Honestly a lot of CN shows in general didn't get a lot of toys, which again, is odd when you consider the numbers a lot of those shows did.

 

It was indeed very weird marketing.  Maybe it came down from on high that these were adult shows and therefore didn't need / shouldn't have toys?  I'm not too sure.  There was a lot of controversy in the late 90's early 2000s about toys for media that were not intended for kids, like the Austin Powers at TRU debate.  Maybe that had something to do with it.  Palisades did have the beginnings of their own line, but strangely started with Harvey Birdman's Phil Ken Sebben and the bear that made cameos instead of Harvey or Peanut.  That was a frequently referenced cautionary tale that we used when line planning.

 

3 hours ago, buttheadsmate said:

What would be the obstacles involved in producing a range of Minimate-compatible accessories ?  I'm specifically thinking about headgear/ hats etc. , capes, wings , masks , hands , custom body-parts ,bulked-biceps etc. etc.  I'm emphatically dismissing the need for any standard Minimate body parts .  One piece of injection-mould-tooling for all of these parts & maybe produce it with no tampo-printing if this becomes cost prohibitive .  All of this might infringe 'whatever ' but I can't see the need for any specific licensing costs ?  I'm not sure whether top-end 3D printing would be an alternative to moulding ?  

 

I'm sure you could run a line of generic add-on parts and not run into any licencing fouls, as there are a number of aftermarket accessories and third-party toys that fly under the radar, (rather, they're on the radar, but companies don't care), but mold and cast is VERY expensive.  With higher production runs, we could get 20-ish parts in a tool.  Lower runs the factor wanted to reduce that to about 10 to 12 parts only, which we operated at regularly for the last 10 years or so.  This is just add-on parts too, not the base body.  The problem is a single tool is easily over ten grand.  They're probably more towards twenty grand at this point.  You'd have to run enough product to make that worth while.  Made to order (or extremely low run) 3D prints are probably the better way to go, which might be more sustainable for the brand in general.  (This was something else we were exploring)

[buttheadsmate]

For years I tried my damnedest to find out the production run of any Minimate release , I'm pretty sure people (Zach esp.) became a bit tired of me asking but I'm convinced that several releases were produced in runs of 1000 or less !  I could never prove it but 'bhmlogic' dictates that those items that were initially scarce ,that remained scarce on ebay & rarely seen on ebay were produced in very low numbers . DST numbered their cases ( e.g. #1 of 100 etc.) , once again this wasn't classed as conclusive 

My reason for pursuing this info was to confirm (to myself) that DST could never have made any money on certain releases . 

 

Edited August 5 by buttheadsmate
grammar

[cylonchaney]

Just to send BHM down another rabbit hole, there is such a thing as home injection molding.  

Molds for this can be produced in the hundreds of dollars price range I believe. The quality would be superior to any current plastic 3d printers that I'm aware of. But I'm not sure how it would compare to factory created product.

I had considered looking into this for creating some accessories in the past.

[Barry]

18 minutes ago, buttheadsmate said:

For years I tried my damnedest to find out the production run of any Minimate release , I'm pretty sure people (Zach esp.) became a bit tired of me asking but I'm convinced that several releases were produced in runs of 1000 or less !  I could never prove it but 'bhmlogic' dictates that those items that were initially scarce ,that remained scarce on ebay & rarely seen on ebay were produced in very low numbers . DST numbered their cases ( e.g. #1 of 100 etc.) , once again this wasn't classed as conclusive 

My reason for pursuing this info was to confirm (to myself) that DST could never have made any money on certain releases . 

 

Unfortunately, I didn't keep files on how many of each were produced, as they were in a document updated weekly by the factory.  Each run was different, with lines in TRU or Walgreens being far greater.  Some hit multiple runs, like Deadpools Resemble, Hulk Through The Ages, and Wave 60.  The Deadpools hit over 10,000 units, might've been closer to 15,000.  Later runs were FAR less, some only in the 300's.  Some of the preorders that didn't get made like John Wick and Bruce Lee were far, far less.  Wick was in the low 100s.  Lee was less than 100.

[buttheadsmate]

I'm genuinely pleased that many Minimate sets were that popular    Thank you for sharing .

Thank you Cylon.....home injection moulding will be my next 'search' .

[SCW]

I still contend DST must have made like 500 of the MMPR 2 sets. They immediately disappeared, were never restocked and pretty much have never shown up on the secondary market at all. Once in a blue moon maybe. But you never even see like individual figures show up. 

I really wanted the Bruce Lee mates. I was pumped up to make a bunch of ninjas and stuff for him to fight and ended up having to do some custom Lee mates of my own.

[Barry]

21 minutes ago, SCW said:

I still contend DST must have made like 500 of the MMPR 2 sets. They immediately disappeared, were never restocked and pretty much have never shown up on the secondary market at all. Once in a blue moon maybe. But you never even see like individual figures show up. 

I really wanted the Bruce Lee mates. I was pumped up to make a bunch of ninjas and stuff for him to fight and ended up having to do some custom Lee mates of my own.

It was lower than 1, for sure, because 1's sales were low.  Production for 2 was altered, but then when it was in stock, people bought 1 as well.  It messed the whole thing up, it should have just been equal for both, honestly. 

[Padrino]

7 hours ago, cylonchaney said:

Just to send BHM down another rabbit hole, there is such a thing as home injection molding.  

Molds for this can be produced in the hundreds of dollars price range I believe. The quality would be superior to any current plastic 3d printers that I'm aware of. But I'm not sure how it would compare to factory created product.

I had considered looking into this for creating some accessories in the past.

I would happily be a customer for multiple hood/capes (a la Infamous Iron Man or the latest Cloak) or any other hood, cape, hairpiece, belt, holster, sword, (not guns, so much) etc. that people would consider. In multiple colors. 

[cylonchaney]

6 hours ago, buttheadsmate said:

Thank you Cylon.....home injection moulding will be my next 'search' .

Steady Craftin with The Crafsman has a few videos on the subject and lots that might be of interest to customizers. Here's an injection molding one. But I think there's one out there when he does his very first run.

 

[Navaan]

1 hour ago, Padrino said:

I would happily be a customer for multiple hood/capes (a la Infamous Iron Man or the latest Cloak) or any other hood, cape, hairpiece, belt, holster, sword, (not guns, so much) etc. that people would consider. In multiple colors. 

I've previously tried to push for this. Wasn't able to get interest but I'd still support it.

 

Imagine made to order pigtails, ponytails, dreads. Hats with hair, helmets, etc. 

[cylonchaney]

21 minutes ago, Navaan said:

I've previously tried to push for this. Wasn't able to get interest but I'd still support it.

 

Imagine made to order pigtails, ponytails, dreads. Hats with hair, helmets, etc. 

You need 3d printing quality and materials to improve for made to order to be feasible. Technically good enough for me now.  But those layer lines ...

For that sweet smooth injection molded look and feel, you need molds. No one is going to make a mold for your one off part. It might be something that could be community kickstarted or something if enough people want pigtails or dreads or whatever. But there has to be enough demand that someone expects to make their money back on molds or else you have to live with 3d printed quality. Those home injection molding machines are hobbyist priced at the low end.

My thought when I was considering it was more towards blank bodies of my block figure in a couple of standard sizes. I think some of the parts with cavities and through holes would be a challenge for a home machine and I'm happy enough with 3d printing. It was a fun fantasy though. Home injection molding would be a good fit for in demand accessories I think.

If someone was heading down this road, I have more detailed versions of a bunch of my weapons. Handgun, revolver, Trek Phaser, Cylon rifle, etc. I'd be happy to share for an Injection molded weapons pack.

[Padrino]

13 hours ago, cylonchaney said:

You need 3d printing quality and materials to improve for made to order to be feasible. Technically good enough for me now.  But those layer lines ...

For that sweet smooth injection molded look and feel, you need molds. No one is going to make a mold for your one off part. It might be something that could be community kickstarted or something if enough people want pigtails or dreads or whatever. But there has to be enough demand that someone expects to make their money back on molds or else you have to live with 3d printed quality. Those home injection molding machines are hobbyist priced at the low end.

My thought when I was considering it was more towards blank bodies of my block figure in a couple of standard sizes. I think some of the parts with cavities and through holes would be a challenge for a home machine and I'm happy enough with 3d printing. It was a fun fantasy though. Home injection molding would be a good fit for in demand accessories I think.

If someone was heading down this road, I have more detailed versions of a bunch of my weapons. Handgun, revolver, Trek Phaser, Cylon rifle, etc. I'd be happy to share for an Injection molded weapons pack.

so how is a mold made? 3d print first, make the impressions, and then use it as a mold? is there another method?