TBT! Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 You didn't answer my question you side stepped it, Surely a quick custom (parts swap) is a custom as it's a modified figure? Why are they Disallowed is the Question? If you believe it's a question of quality then they won't win anyway, if it's an elitist I only want 'hard to do customs" in my contest that stops it being fun for a lot of people that are not as gifted as the likes of Luke or Antacost. I'd just like to understand the reasoning for this rule? T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 You didn't answer my question you side stepped it, Surely a quick custom (parts swap) is a custom as it's a modified figure? Why are they Disallowed is the Question? If you believe it's a question of quality then they won't win anyway, if it's an elitist I only want 'hard to do customs" in my contest that stops it being fun for a lot of people that are not as gifted as the likes of Luke or Antacost. I'd just like to understand the reasoning for this rule? T. I didn't realize that you wanted a full explanation, Tim. I am not trying to be an elitist - I want people to put some more time and effort into their submissions than a simple parts swap would require. Which, as I mentioned previously, could be repainting a hair piece or something even smaller, just as long as some kind of modification is done. And no one is as gifted as Luke or Mini-Myte or antacost so why should anyone bother at all for that matter? Well, because it's fun or it's suppose to be anyway. The only reason that I run these contests is to bring a little joy to the customizing and minimate community - not to get into debates about the merits of quick-customs. And I don't really understand such opposition coming from you Tim since you have done more than quick-customs in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBT! Posted June 16, 2006 Author Share Posted June 16, 2006 "And no one is as gifted as Luke or Mini-Myte or antacost so why should anyone bother at all for that matter?".. sums up a worrying attitude. It's obviously 'not for fun' as you are restricting who can enter by making the ability to paint etc a prerequisite not imagination or vision, quick customs can be just as impressive as 'break out the paint' customs if they are done with vision and flair. Seems there is an air of duality about your position here Fujis. Dont get me wrong, I'm not trying to pick a fight, I'm trying to understand who you are expecting to enter? If your claim that no one but Antacost. Luke or Mini-myte would stand a chance then why should anyone else bother to go the extra mile and 'break out the paints'? You are alienating a potentially large audience of people that you are claiming to make this fun for. It should be people can enter at their level not a predefined 'advanced' level you are making so you can go 'Wow look at the high quality of my contest'... Either you are looking for Pro's or fun.. which is it? I just dont understand the rule that's all. T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 You are trying to pick a fight Tim and you are succeeding. And you made the comment about the skill of certain customizers and I tried to play on how ridiculous that sounded. And you're right this contest isn't fun anymore. I hire an artist out of my own pocket, take the time to contact DST to get some prizes, all in the name of fostering the community and here I am defending the rules of my contest (which I have chosen not to participate in because of complaints received on the AA forums)! If you don't like the rules; don't play. It's as simple as that. And if you want to discuss this further may I suggest we do so through PM's. I'd still like some people to enjoy this contest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 OK Guys, I know I'm not a Mod or anything, but I just want to step in and say: Calm Down! Fujis idea for this contest is a good one, but I'm also with Tim on the Quick Customs thing. Like Tim said, A Quickie can sometimes be more striking than a fully-fledged custom. I also agree with Fujis on taking this to PMs. That's just my two cents on this matter... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickyroma Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 OK Guys, I know I'm not a Mod or anything, but I just want to step in and say: Calm Down! Fujis idea for this contest is a good one, but I'm also with Tim on the Quick Customs thing. Like Tim said, A Quickie can sometimes be more striking than a fully-fledged custom. I also agree with Fujis on taking this to PMs. That's just my two cents on this matter... I agree with Logan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Well, no, I actually agree with Fujis. Quick-Customs have their place. I don't like cutting up/repainting/changing irreparably my Minimates. I love them all too much and frankly they cost too much. Just the other day I made a Gambit quick custom. They're fun, and that captures the greatness of the line. However, changing them in some way changes the way you think about the entire thing. You can make quick customs all day, but if you are going to be forced to change something, you're gona stop and think about it, not throw it together. The purpose of the no-quicky rule is, not to make people feel ashamed at their kitbashing skills, but to make people stop and actually think before they do it. And honestly, he didn't say "repaint a FCBD MM into Marvel Deadpool" He said "SOME modification". I take that to mean shave the silver off Whitchblade's hair piece, or paint a torso lime green, or make little putty accessories for them, ect. ect. I mean we're not talking serious skill. Switch the heads on Thing and paint him green, making FF era She-Hulk. As I understand it, the rule is not to make people angry, but to make people think. And the rule is very laxed, he didn't say "repaint the entire thing". Just my $0.02 worth BTW, Fujis, please don't cancel the contest. I, for one, still wish to participate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBT! Posted June 16, 2006 Author Share Posted June 16, 2006 Well, no, I actually agree with Fujis. Quick-Customs have their place.... ...BTW, Fujis, please don't cancel the contest. I, for one, still wish to participate. Interesting points there TM2, but the point that it's alienating a percentage of those that might want to play along, yes spending time and effort is a good thing, trust me I understand the differences between a pop the pieces custom and something that has a lot of 'changes' as much as anyone. Surely if someone comes up with a quick custom that people go 'oh yeah that does look like ...(enter movie character name here)' then that is all thats needed and enough thought has gone into it? Some of the guys here have lives and kids etc and wont have time to build a full on custom in month, heck even before I unintentionally alienated myself from the contest I was questioning if I'd find time. As for the ruling of 'you must add paint or sculpt' where is that line drawn? How a bout a quick custom with a small blob of paint on the sole of the foot, there that's modified but is still a quick custom. My intent here was not to get the contest closed down ( Which despite the faux drama of one of the previous posts, shouldn't happen because of someone asking questions in the Q&A part of the thread.) but to question and clarify one small rule, the response to that was overly defensive and out of proportion to the question. T. p.s. Folks, these are just toys not life and death, no one is going to make it into the industry as a result of these sorts of competitions so they should be fun for everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Surely if someone comes up with a quick custom that people go 'oh yeah that does look like ...(enter movie character name here)' then that is all thats needed and enough thought has gone into it? ... As for the ruling of 'you must add paint or sculpt' where is that line drawn? How a bout a quick custom with a small blob of paint on the sole of the foot, there that's modified but is still a quick custom. I totally see your point. However, there's another side to that problem. For example, SDCC Jonny Storm and Gambit share the same head. What's to stop me from putting his head on another torse and calling him a new character? (Oh wait, I guess I did already ) My point being you have to draw a line somewhere. I will take time to sit down and think, and I know you will too. But where's the line to cross that stops a n00b from switching heads and entering? There's no thought, no character. The again, if he dribbles paint on it, and it looks awful, but hes a 10 year old kid and put a ton of effort into it, are we gona not let him enter even though it looks like crap? What if he only did a quick custom, and still put his spirt into it. My intent here was not to get the contest closed down ( Which despite the faux drama of one of the previous posts, shouldn't happen because of someone asking questions in the Q&A part of the thread.) but to question and clarify one small rule, the response to that was overly defensive and out of proportion to the question. I can see that this is actually going to take more throught then any one thought at first. And please don't feel like you've been backed into a corner. I'm relativly new here, but I feel that we can all get along, if not all be friends. You're more then welcome to join in any time. p.s. Folks, these are just toys not life and death Yep! Totally! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBT! Posted June 16, 2006 Author Share Posted June 16, 2006 But where's the line to cross that stops a n00b from switching heads and entering? There's no thought, no character. The again, if he dribbles paint on it, and it looks awful, but hes a 10 year old kid and put a ton of effort into it, are we gona not let him enter even though it looks like crap? What if he only did a quick custom, and still put his spirt into it. Good examples... Thats just the point, so what if someone whos new to customising swaps heads and it vaguely looks like a movie character and enters, sure they may not have a hope of winning but they got to be part of the fun as much as the paint dribbler... that was my point in essence I'm relativly new here, but I feel that we can all get along, if not all be friends. You're more then welcome to join in any time. You are new but fitting just fine, heck we're all new in some ways the boards only been here for two weeks! You're sharing your thoughts, making good points and keeping it civil which is all we ask And for the most part we dont squable here, we just have diferences of opinion sometimes This board is probably the most relaxed & friendly place I've come across online. T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Okay, I have a prime example. Let me illistrate it. 1) Kent Clark. Odviously Bruce Wayne's head on Prof X's body. I think we all agree that this shouldn't be allowed. 2) Clone Trooper. Here's an interesting problem. I took a FCBD MM and turned his torse around, then stuck on a CT helmet and gun. According to the rules, this is enterable. But how does it differ from #1? 3) Random Thug. I think this is where most of us are hung up. I actually spent some time on this guy. Stark's head, Elektra's hair, NXM Wolvy's torso, jacket and legs, Punisher's arms and FF gloves. He's an apleaing sight, and while you can tell what parts came from where, there are lots of them. Yet while he is a good character, he wouldn't be allowed. On this point, I kinda agree. he wasn't hard to put together, and I didn't give him any SERIOUS thought. However, if I had painted his boots black, he would be allowed. Like I said, this will take some thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Okay, guys, that's enough. Quick-customs are in and I'm having all of this deleted (or moved) as it serves no purpose here. Can we all play nice now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 But where's the line to cross that stops a n00b from switching heads and entering? There's no thought, no character. The again, if he dribbles paint on it, and it looks awful, but hes a 10 year old kid and put a ton of effort into it, are we gona not let him enter even though it looks like crap? What if he only did a quick custom, and still put his spirt into it. Good examples... Thats just the point, so what if someone whos new to customising swaps heads and it vaguely looks like a movie character and enters, sure they may not have a hope of winning but they got to be part of the fun as much as the paint dribbler... that was my point in essence I hadn't thought of it like that before... I like that sentiment. But it still... I don't know. Maybe I'm just hung up on it. *shrug* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Okay, guys, that's enough. Quick-customs are in and I'm having all of this deleted (or moved) as it serves no purpose here. Can we all play nice now? Party Pooper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 However, changing them in some way changes the way you think about the entire thing. You can make quick customs all day, but if you are going to be forced to change something, you're gona stop and think about it, not throw it together. The purpose of the no-quicky rule is, not to make people feel ashamed at their kitbashing skills, but to make people stop and actually think before they do it. I hadn't even put that much thought into it but I like the way you phrased that. As for the ruling of 'you must add paint or sculpt' where is that line drawn? How a bout a quick custom with a small blob of paint on the sole of the foot, there that's modified but is still a quick custom. There was no need to be more specific on this point - I was trying to be vague to give people a loop-hole so they could have entered a quick-custom with "a small blob of paint on the sole of the foot". As I said previously, some modicfication was required. Some of the guys here have lives and kids etc and wont have time to build a full on custom in month...Me too. Like Tim said, A Quickie can sometimes be more striking than a fully-fledged custom. Sorry, I completely disagree on this one. QC's are interesting and take some creativity but a different kind than is required to modify something. QC's are puzzles; customs are paintings. It should be people can enter at their level not a predefined 'advanced' level...Well, that's a nice thought, isn't it? In fact, why should anything be difficult...have you read Harrison Bergeron lately? ...despite the faux drama of one of the previous posts, shouldn't happen because of someone asking questions in the Q&A part of the thread...the response to that was overly defensive and out of proportion to the question. Considering I was being called an "elitist" and having my intentions about the contest questioned, I think I responded appropriately. My reasoning behind not allowing QC's is that I wanted people to try something new: try painting a hair piece, try sculpting a cape - and let them see for themselves how difficult it can be but how rewarding it can be! I started customizing because of the work I saw on this forum. I was inspired by people's work and I wanted to try my hand at it. As Dinobot said I wanted to get people to think "outside the box" which is what this whole contest is about - new possibilities. BTW, Fujis, please don't cancel the contest. I, for one, still wish to participate. My intent here was not to get the contest closed down...And what is all this talk about the contest being closed down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke314pi Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 I feel that many quick customs require more "out of the box" thinking than painted customs. I have seen many quick customs that have blown me away, and don't even look like a combination of existing parts. I think the comparisson between puzzles and paintings is misplaced. I think a better comparisson might be making a sculpture by combining various materials versus making a sculpture out of clay. In the end, they are both sculptures, and can be quite beautiful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdyCarter Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 I feel that many quick customs require more "out of the box" thinking than painted customs. I have seen many quick customs that have blown me away, and don't even look like a combination of existing parts. I think the comparisson between puzzles and paintings is misplaced. I think a better comparisson might be making a sculpture by combining various materials versus making a sculpture out of clay. In the end, they are both sculptures, and can be quite beautiful. Couldnt have put it better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Someone needs to show me these QC's that are "striking" and that have "blown them away". They are interesting to be sure but I was blown away by antacost's Sorceress. And call me a skeptic but thinking "outside the box" requires more that simply rearranging parts. QC's are a guess and check process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdyCarter Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 I get the feeling people are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Please agree to disagree. Please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM2 Dinobot Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Well, thinking outside the box means diffrent stuff to diffrent people. I, for one, look at the shape of something to see if it will work. So what if the hair piece is black. I've got paint and an exo knife. Ain't no Minimate gona slow me down. So thinking outside the box means looking at it two ways. The chape, or the color. and lets face it, Minimates are basicly one shape. Okay, so I just woke up and I'm rambling. Please ignore me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBT! Posted June 16, 2006 Author Share Posted June 16, 2006 I get the feeling people are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Please agree to disagree. Please. Oddly that's exactly what I did yesterday Mr C.... I actually typed a reply to one of the last posts but decided not to post it because I didn't want to rock the boat further out of respect for the board. Fujis I don't have any hard feelings, it's your contest to run it how you like & good luck to you and I hope you get the entries that you are hoping for. T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 ...it's your contest to run it how you like & good luck to you and I hope you get the entries that you are hoping for. Maybe you should have said that yesterday after my initial reply instead of calling me an "elitist". And don't play the martyr Tim - you were rocking the boat so why stop now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdyCarter Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 Lets all stop rocking the board/boat please. This is kind of a non issue now, as Fujis has allowed QCs in his contest. (dont make me moderate anything... please) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanester Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 OK, one word here. TOYS. Toys = fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fujis Posted June 16, 2006 Share Posted June 16, 2006 ^^^ Okay, you guys are right. Toys, toys... I'm not interested in getting into a flame-fest but I do take offense to having my motives called into question when my only intention with my contests is to bring some fun to the community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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