TRU 2013 Fan Poll Boxset still happening?

[thereasonsy]

Hoping it's X Themed. A Dark Phoenix Saga set would rock.

Dark Phoenix

Marvel Girl

Sebastian Shaw

Cyclops (with optic blast)

The Gladiator

Disco Dazzler

Seems to fit the criteria. If it's Avengers theme I'd hope for a new Wasp, Black Widow or Vision to be in the choices. Whatever two don't win get put in a TRU wave right?

I am all for this. Even a Hellfire Club 4 pack would work with Shaw, Leland, Pierce and sewer Wolverine. Yes, I am that desperate for this pack.

[elhonez]

Zach already said: one villain, new version. Seems pretty clear it's going to be Age of Ultron?

[Jatta Pake]

I think versions of the characters depicted from the "Pym-less" Universe would be compelling. Here are the ramifications of Pym's death prior to creating Ultron according to Bendis.

1 - Creation of Ultron

A - No Vision

1 - No marriage to Scarlet Witch/Immortus plan to prevent her from breeding possibly derailed

2 - No birth of children (Speed & Wiccan of Young Avengers)

3 - No undoing of their children, which Immortus engineered in part to ensure Scarlet Witch’s mental instability and thus pliability

a – Mephisto and Master Pandemonium affected

4 - No Leonia, NJ-based events (Vision and Scarlet Witch maxi-series)

a - No opportunity for Crystal to meet and have affair with Norman Webster

1 - No divorce from Quicksilver

5 - No defeating Salem’s Seven

a – they conquer the witch town of New Salem, and we have an entire town of evil black mages working against humanity

6 – Does not form West Coast Avengers

7 - No Scarlet Witch insanity

a – No Disassembled deaths of Ant-Man/Lang, Jack of Hearts, Vision destruction

b – No M/M-Day/Decimation

1- Hundreds of X-Men/mutant stories undone

8 - Grim Reaper’s Lethal Legion potentially defeat and slay Avengers (Captain America, Black Panther, Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch)

1- Thousands of ripple effects from those deaths

2- Grim Reaper won’t later feel the need to revive his “dead” brother Wonder Man as a zombie, which means Wonder Man presumably remains dormant

9 - Vision not present as one of the Dead Avengers who save the living Avengers during the Chaos War.

B - No Crimson Cowl

1 - No Jarvis betrayal

C - No Jocasta

1 - Lots of battles go that bit worse without her (without her neutralizing the internal defenses, Beast doesn’t manage to get inside Red Ronin during his rampage, robot destroys the Long Island expressway during rush hour., she was instrumental in team’s first defeat of Taskmaster, Evolutionary War finale, etc.)

D - No Alkhema

1 - No Bio-Synthezoids, War Toys, Robos

2 - Mockingbird not abducted by Skrulls, or at least not in the same way (her abduction by Alkhema and the team’s battle with Alkie was the cover for the Skrulls’ abduction of Mockingbird)

E - No slaughter in Slorenia

1 - No giant Bloodwraith

F - No sentient Iron Man armor

1 - Blacklash doesn’t die

G - No Victor Mancha

1 - Gertrude Yorkes doesn’t die

H - No role in Annihilation: Conquest

1 - Star-Lord’s Guardians of the Galaxy don’t form

2 - Deathcry doesn’t die

3 - Spaceknights not taken over by Phalanx

4 – No further devastation of Kree Empire

5 - Moondragon doesn’t die

a – Phylla-Vell does not become Martyr

6 - Second major war that causes the Fault doesn’t happen - possibly negating the result of War of Kings and the Cancerverse’s attempted infestation of the universe, further negating Thanos’ resurrection and Nova (Rider) and Star-Lord’s sacrifice

I - No marriage to Jocasta

J - No possession of the Intelligencia’s inert Spaceknight body

K - No revival of Jim Hammond, the original Human Torch, after Mad Thinker’s usage of him against the FF

1 - Spitfire would not have been rejuvenated without a second dose of Human Torch blood

A - Spitfire’s absence may have affected various missions by the New Invaders and MI-13

2 - Marriage to Janet Van Dyne

A - Wasp’s chauffeur Charles Matthews never fired (events leading to same in Marvel Feature wouldn’t have happened without Hank), and Charles possibly never exposed as the Whirlwind/David Cannon (it was Pym who finally figured it out after years of Charles’ double identity going unsuspected by Hank, Jan and all the other Avengers). More than once, Whirlwind (David Cannon) has captured or defeated the Wasp, only to have Hank Pym arrive to save her or team up with her. Without Hank, it’s likely Wasp might not have escaped one of Whirlwind’s attempts.

3 - Bill Foster might have become Black Goliath sooner

A – Become a more confident, A-list hero without being in Hank Pym’s shadow

4 - Equipment being available for Scott Lang to steal to become Ant-Man and rescue surgeon to save his daughter’s life (Even if he still broke into Pym’s old lab and became Ant-Man, he’d have died during his first mission if Pym hadn’t been secretly tagging along and protected him a few times.)

A - Cassie dies

1 - No Stature

B - Surgeon Lang rescued, Erica Sondheim, remains imprisoned by her captor

1 – Not available to later implant bio-tech chip that restored crippled Tony Stark, and later saved his life when it went wrong - without her, Stark either remains crippled or dies

5 - Becoming Yellowjacket

A - Rita de Mara does not become Yellowjacket

1 – Is not present in Evolutionary War finale

2 – Is not present in any Guardians of the Galaxy story

3 – No death during the Crossing

4 – Is not present in Chaos War to help save Avengers, others

6 - Joining Defenders (as YJ)

A- does not rescue captured Defenders Dr. Strange, Valkyrie and Hulk from the Squadron Sinister

7 - Mental breakdown/imprisonment/divorce from Janet Van Dyne

A - No court-martial

B - Jan doesn’t have affair with Tony Stark/Iron Man while Hank was imprisoned

C - Jan doesn’t become the chastened Avengers leader later on (significantly affecting Masters of Evil’s siege of Mansion and Kang Dynasty, amongst others) OR conversely, Hank’s death forces this to happen much earlier

8 - Preventing Egghead’s schemes

A - Egghead would have forced his niece Trish Starr into his robot, destroying her individuality and body.

9 - Death of Egghead

A - Egghead remains with Intelligencia, possibly eliminating MODOK’s involvement - no Red Hulk/She-Hulk, World War Hulks, Hulked-Out Heroes

10 - Joining West Coast Avengers (which wouldn’t exist without Vision)

A - No participation in Time-Lost Saga - possibly leaving WCA stranded in the past

11 - No creation of MODAM (AIM scientists were unable to advance SODAM’s development without Pym’s help.)

A - The Cosmic Cube disaster during “Taking AIM” might have been worse, with MODOK being reactivated sooner

B - No Number None (the baby MODOK who claims his mother is MODAM)

C - No SILENT, no HATE, and no Nextwave: Agents of HATE

1 - Undoing character development leading to a more independently confident Photon, a more bloodthirsty Elsa Bloodstone and the human-hating/zombie killing Machine Man

12 - No dimension-crossing experiments resulting in fugitive St. Looie’s hitman from being lost in “Otherwhere”

13 - Relationship with Firebird/Espirita

14 - Relationship with Tigra

A – As mentioned below, Tigra’s son would probably never be born, since the Skrull who fathered said son was posing as Pym

15 – Participation in stopping Vibro from destroying LA with earthquakes

16 - Participation in the Crossing

A - Jan not mutated, dies of injuries at hands of Iron Man

17 - Participation in Heroes Reborn

A - Counter-Earth (Franklin) native and Avengers janitor Ernest Sanger would never have become Mant, the size-changing leader of the Remnants

18 - Participation in Destiny War (Possible Immortus picked a different Pym from another era/reality, so things might well have still gone much as seen)

A – Doesn’t double cross both sides as Yellowjacket

B - Rick Jones does not get involved in final battle

C - Time-Keepers survive

1 – No final event prompting Lilandra to sponsor Maximum Security

a – Quasar does not absorb Ego

2 - Reality-616 destroyed by Time-Keepers

19 - Curing of Firestar’s radiation problem

A – Leading to earlier or worse cancer/death

20 - Pym not available to supervise treatment and containment of Jack of Hearts’ unstable physiology

21 - Replacement by Skrull(s)

A - Various Skrulls that replaced him not participate in Initiative/Camp Hammond

B - The Skrulls would have needed another highly placed superhuman genius to replace instead of Hank Pym.

C - No GI-Ant-Man suit for Eric O’Grady to steal

1 - O’Grady dies in Helicarrier crash, never becomes Ant-Man

D – No Skrull relationship with Tigra

1 - William Garson never born

22 - Dark Reign events

A - No Infinite Mansion

B - No Dark Reign-era Mighty Avengers

1 - Amadeus Cho/Vision Jonas/Stature’s membership negated

2 - Chthon victorious

C - Not named Scientist Supreme

23 - Instruction at Avengers Academy

A - Veil, Hazmat, Mettle - not receiving treatment for various conditions

[Onyx_6]

I think versions of the characters depicted from the "Pym-less" Universe would be compelling. Here are the ramifications of Pym's death prior to creating Ultron according to Bendis.

1 - Creation of Ultron

A - No Vision

1 - No marriage to Scarlet Witch/Immortus plan to prevent her from breeding possibly derailed

2 - No birth of children (Speed & Wiccan of Young Avengers)

3 - No undoing of their children, which Immortus engineered in part to ensure Scarlet Witchs mental instability and thus pliability

a Mephisto and Master Pandemonium affected

4 - No Leonia, NJ-based events (Vision and Scarlet Witch maxi-series)

a - No opportunity for Crystal to meet and have affair with Norman Webster

1 - No divorce from Quicksilver

5 - No defeating Salems Seven

a they conquer the witch town of New Salem, and we have an entire town of evil black mages working against humanity

6 Does not form West Coast Avengers

7 - No Scarlet Witch insanity

a No Disassembled deaths of Ant-Man/Lang, Jack of Hearts, Vision destruction

b No M/M-Day/Decimation

1- Hundreds of X-Men/mutant stories undone

8 - Grim Reapers Lethal Legion potentially defeat and slay Avengers (Captain America, Black Panther, Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch)

1- Thousands of ripple effects from those deaths

2- Grim Reaper wont later feel the need to revive his dead brother Wonder Man as a zombie, which means Wonder Man presumably remains dormant

9 - Vision not present as one of the Dead Avengers who save the living Avengers during the Chaos War.

B - No Crimson Cowl

1 - No Jarvis betrayal

C - No Jocasta

1 - Lots of battles go that bit worse without her (without her neutralizing the internal defenses, Beast doesnt manage to get inside Red Ronin during his rampage, robot destroys the Long Island expressway during rush hour., she was instrumental in teams first defeat of Taskmaster, Evolutionary War finale, etc.)

D - No Alkhema

1 - No Bio-Synthezoids, War Toys, Robos

2 - Mockingbird not abducted by Skrulls, or at least not in the same way (her abduction by Alkhema and the teams battle with Alkie was the cover for the Skrulls abduction of Mockingbird)

E - No slaughter in Slorenia

1 - No giant Bloodwraith

F - No sentient Iron Man armor

1 - Blacklash doesnt die

G - No Victor Mancha

1 - Gertrude Yorkes doesnt die

H - No role in Annihilation: Conquest

1 - Star-Lords Guardians of the Galaxy dont form

2 - Deathcry doesnt die

3 - Spaceknights not taken over by Phalanx

4 No further devastation of Kree Empire

5 - Moondragon doesnt die

a Phylla-Vell does not become Martyr

6 - Second major war that causes the Fault doesnt happen - possibly negating the result of War of Kings and the Cancerverses attempted infestation of the universe, further negating Thanos resurrection and Nova (Rider) and Star-Lords sacrifice

I - No marriage to Jocasta

J - No possession of the Intelligencias inert Spaceknight body

K - No revival of Jim Hammond, the original Human Torch, after Mad Thinkers usage of him against the FF

1 - Spitfire would not have been rejuvenated without a second dose of Human Torch blood

A - Spitfires absence may have affected various missions by the New Invaders and MI-13

2 - Marriage to Janet Van Dyne

A - Wasps chauffeur Charles Matthews never fired (events leading to same in Marvel Feature wouldnt have happened without Hank), and Charles possibly never exposed as the Whirlwind/David Cannon (it was Pym who finally figured it out after years of Charles double identity going unsuspected by Hank, Jan and all the other Avengers). More than once, Whirlwind (David Cannon) has captured or defeated the Wasp, only to have Hank Pym arrive to save her or team up with her. Without Hank, its likely Wasp might not have escaped one of Whirlwinds attempts.

3 - Bill Foster might have become Black Goliath sooner

A Become a more confident, A-list hero without being in Hank Pyms shadow

4 - Equipment being available for Scott Lang to steal to become Ant-Man and rescue surgeon to save his daughters life (Even if he still broke into Pyms old lab and became Ant-Man, hed have died during his first mission if Pym hadnt been secretly tagging along and protected him a few times.)

A - Cassie dies

1 - No Stature

B - Surgeon Lang rescued, Erica Sondheim, remains imprisoned by her captor

1 Not available to later implant bio-tech chip that restored crippled Tony Stark, and later saved his life when it went wrong - without her, Stark either remains crippled or dies

5 - Becoming Yellowjacket

A - Rita de Mara does not become Yellowjacket

1 Is not present in Evolutionary War finale

2 Is not present in any Guardians of the Galaxy story

3 No death during the Crossing

4 Is not present in Chaos War to help save Avengers, others

6 - Joining Defenders (as YJ)

A- does not rescue captured Defenders Dr. Strange, Valkyrie and Hulk from the Squadron Sinister

7 - Mental breakdown/imprisonment/divorce from Janet Van Dyne

A - No court-martial

B - Jan doesnt have affair with Tony Stark/Iron Man while Hank was imprisoned

C - Jan doesnt become the chastened Avengers leader later on (significantly affecting Masters of Evils siege of Mansion and Kang Dynasty, amongst others) OR conversely, Hanks death forces this to happen much earlier

8 - Preventing Eggheads schemes

A - Egghead would have forced his niece Trish Starr into his robot, destroying her individuality and body.

9 - Death of Egghead

A - Egghead remains with Intelligencia, possibly eliminating MODOKs involvement - no Red Hulk/She-Hulk, World War Hulks, Hulked-Out Heroes

10 - Joining West Coast Avengers (which wouldnt exist without Vision)

A - No participation in Time-Lost Saga - possibly leaving WCA stranded in the past

11 - No creation of MODAM (AIM scientists were unable to advance SODAMs development without Pyms help.)

A - The Cosmic Cube disaster during Taking AIM might have been worse, with MODOK being reactivated sooner

B - No Number None (the baby MODOK who claims his mother is MODAM)

C - No SILENT, no HATE, and no Nextwave: Agents of HATE

1 - Undoing character development leading to a more independently confident Photon, a more bloodthirsty Elsa Bloodstone and the human-hating/zombie killing Machine Man

12 - No dimension-crossing experiments resulting in fugitive St. Looies hitman from being lost in Otherwhere

13 - Relationship with Firebird/Espirita

14 - Relationship with Tigra

A As mentioned below, Tigras son would probably never be born, since the Skrull who fathered said son was posing as Pym

15 Participation in stopping Vibro from destroying LA with earthquakes

16 - Participation in the Crossing

A - Jan not mutated, dies of injuries at hands of Iron Man

17 - Participation in Heroes Reborn

A - Counter-Earth (Franklin) native and Avengers janitor Ernest Sanger would never have become Mant, the size-changing leader of the Remnants

18 - Participation in Destiny War (Possible Immortus picked a different Pym from another era/reality, so things might well have still gone much as seen)

A Doesnt double cross both sides as Yellowjacket

B - Rick Jones does not get involved in final battle

C - Time-Keepers survive

1 No final event prompting Lilandra to sponsor Maximum Security

a Quasar does not absorb Ego

2 - Reality-616 destroyed by Time-Keepers

19 - Curing of Firestars radiation problem

A Leading to earlier or worse cancer/death

20 - Pym not available to supervise treatment and containment of Jack of Hearts unstable physiology

21 - Replacement by Skrull(s)

A - Various Skrulls that replaced him not participate in Initiative/Camp Hammond

B - The Skrulls would have needed another highly placed superhuman genius to replace instead of Hank Pym.

C - No GI-Ant-Man suit for Eric OGrady to steal

1 - OGrady dies in Helicarrier crash, never becomes Ant-Man

D No Skrull relationship with Tigra

1 - William Garson never born

22 - Dark Reign events

A - No Infinite Mansion

B - No Dark Reign-era Mighty Avengers

1 - Amadeus Cho/Vision Jonas/Statures membership negated

2 - Chthon victorious

C - Not named Scientist Supreme

23 - Instruction at Avengers Academy

A - Veil, Hazmat, Mettle - not receiving treatment for various conditions

Wouldn't it be easier to list the events in the 616 that still happen? I didn't realize Hank had that much influence, although I can see it.

[thereasonsy]

Zach already said: one villain, new version. Seems pretty clear it's going to be Age of Ultron?

But a guy can dream can't he?

[stack32]

If it's Age of Ultron then DST will have saved me a lot money with the last few box set announcements.

[Freaqualizer]

If it's Age of Ultron then DST will have saved me a lot money with the last few box set announcements.

Same thing people said about the Thunderbolts set. And that seemed to change alot of opinions when it was shown. Personally, I will take a more wait and see approach. Even if it is Age of Ultron, it'd pretty friggin sweet to have an Angela minimate.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Freaqualizer

[thereasonsy]

If it's Age of Ultron then DST will have saved me a lot money with the last few box set announcements.

Same thing people said about the Thunderbolts set. And that seemed to change alot of opinions when it was shown. Personally, I will take a more wait and see approach. Even if it is Age of Ultron, it'd pretty friggin sweet to have an Angela minimate.

That's the rub. I know I am going to buy the set regardless because it is good for scraps but that doesn't mean I have to like it. I'll be annoyed if Angela gets a mate before mainstays of the Marvel U.

[bigvis497]

If it's Age of Ultron then DST will have saved me a lot money with the last few box set announcements.

I'm with ya.

[Valo487]

I think versions of the characters depicted from the "Pym-less" Universe would be compelling. Here are the ramifications of Pym's death prior to creating Ultron according to Bendis.

1 - Creation of Ultron

A - No Vision

1 - No marriage to Scarlet Witch/Immortus plan to prevent her from breeding possibly derailed

2 - No birth of children (Speed & Wiccan of Young Avengers)

3 - No undoing of their children, which Immortus engineered in part to ensure Scarlet Witchs mental instability and thus pliability

a Mephisto and Master Pandemonium affected

4 - No Leonia, NJ-based events (Vision and Scarlet Witch maxi-series)

a - No opportunity for Crystal to meet and have affair with Norman Webster

1 - No divorce from Quicksilver

5 - No defeating Salems Seven

a they conquer the witch town of New Salem, and we have an entire town of evil black mages working against humanity

6 Does not form West Coast Avengers

7 - No Scarlet Witch insanity

a No Disassembled deaths of Ant-Man/Lang, Jack of Hearts, Vision destruction

b No M/M-Day/Decimation

1- Hundreds of X-Men/mutant stories undone

8 - Grim Reapers Lethal Legion potentially defeat and slay Avengers (Captain America, Black Panther, Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch)

1- Thousands of ripple effects from those deaths

2- Grim Reaper wont later feel the need to revive his dead brother Wonder Man as a zombie, which means Wonder Man presumably remains dormant

9 - Vision not present as one of the Dead Avengers who save the living Avengers during the Chaos War.

B - No Crimson Cowl

1 - No Jarvis betrayal

C - No Jocasta

1 - Lots of battles go that bit worse without her (without her neutralizing the internal defenses, Beast doesnt manage to get inside Red Ronin during his rampage, robot destroys the Long Island expressway during rush hour., she was instrumental in teams first defeat of Taskmaster, Evolutionary War finale, etc.)

D - No Alkhema

1 - No Bio-Synthezoids, War Toys, Robos

2 - Mockingbird not abducted by Skrulls, or at least not in the same way (her abduction by Alkhema and the teams battle with Alkie was the cover for the Skrulls abduction of Mockingbird)

E - No slaughter in Slorenia

1 - No giant Bloodwraith

F - No sentient Iron Man armor

1 - Blacklash doesnt die

G - No Victor Mancha

1 - Gertrude Yorkes doesnt die

H - No role in Annihilation: Conquest

1 - Star-Lords Guardians of the Galaxy dont form

2 - Deathcry doesnt die

3 - Spaceknights not taken over by Phalanx

4 No further devastation of Kree Empire

5 - Moondragon doesnt die

a Phylla-Vell does not become Martyr

6 - Second major war that causes the Fault doesnt happen - possibly negating the result of War of Kings and the Cancerverses attempted infestation of the universe, further negating Thanos resurrection and Nova (Rider) and Star-Lords sacrifice

I - No marriage to Jocasta

J - No possession of the Intelligencias inert Spaceknight body

K - No revival of Jim Hammond, the original Human Torch, after Mad Thinkers usage of him against the FF

1 - Spitfire would not have been rejuvenated without a second dose of Human Torch blood

A - Spitfires absence may have affected various missions by the New Invaders and MI-13

2 - Marriage to Janet Van Dyne

A - Wasps chauffeur Charles Matthews never fired (events leading to same in Marvel Feature wouldnt have happened without Hank), and Charles possibly never exposed as the Whirlwind/David Cannon (it was Pym who finally figured it out after years of Charles double identity going unsuspected by Hank, Jan and all the other Avengers). More than once, Whirlwind (David Cannon) has captured or defeated the Wasp, only to have Hank Pym arrive to save her or team up with her. Without Hank, its likely Wasp might not have escaped one of Whirlwinds attempts.

3 - Bill Foster might have become Black Goliath sooner

A Become a more confident, A-list hero without being in Hank Pyms shadow

4 - Equipment being available for Scott Lang to steal to become Ant-Man and rescue surgeon to save his daughters life (Even if he still broke into Pyms old lab and became Ant-Man, hed have died during his first mission if Pym hadnt been secretly tagging along and protected him a few times.)

A - Cassie dies

1 - No Stature

B - Surgeon Lang rescued, Erica Sondheim, remains imprisoned by her captor

1 Not available to later implant bio-tech chip that restored crippled Tony Stark, and later saved his life when it went wrong - without her, Stark either remains crippled or dies

5 - Becoming Yellowjacket

A - Rita de Mara does not become Yellowjacket

1 Is not present in Evolutionary War finale

2 Is not present in any Guardians of the Galaxy story

3 No death during the Crossing

4 Is not present in Chaos War to help save Avengers, others

6 - Joining Defenders (as YJ)

A- does not rescue captured Defenders Dr. Strange, Valkyrie and Hulk from the Squadron Sinister

7 - Mental breakdown/imprisonment/divorce from Janet Van Dyne

A - No court-martial

B - Jan doesnt have affair with Tony Stark/Iron Man while Hank was imprisoned

C - Jan doesnt become the chastened Avengers leader later on (significantly affecting Masters of Evils siege of Mansion and Kang Dynasty, amongst others) OR conversely, Hanks death forces this to happen much earlier

8 - Preventing Eggheads schemes

A - Egghead would have forced his niece Trish Starr into his robot, destroying her individuality and body.

9 - Death of Egghead

A - Egghead remains with Intelligencia, possibly eliminating MODOKs involvement - no Red Hulk/She-Hulk, World War Hulks, Hulked-Out Heroes

10 - Joining West Coast Avengers (which wouldnt exist without Vision)

A - No participation in Time-Lost Saga - possibly leaving WCA stranded in the past

11 - No creation of MODAM (AIM scientists were unable to advance SODAMs development without Pyms help.)

A - The Cosmic Cube disaster during Taking AIM might have been worse, with MODOK being reactivated sooner

B - No Number None (the baby MODOK who claims his mother is MODAM)

C - No SILENT, no HATE, and no Nextwave: Agents of HATE

1 - Undoing character development leading to a more independently confident Photon, a more bloodthirsty Elsa Bloodstone and the human-hating/zombie killing Machine Man

12 - No dimension-crossing experiments resulting in fugitive St. Looies hitman from being lost in Otherwhere

13 - Relationship with Firebird/Espirita

14 - Relationship with Tigra

A As mentioned below, Tigras son would probably never be born, since the Skrull who fathered said son was posing as Pym

15 Participation in stopping Vibro from destroying LA with earthquakes

16 - Participation in the Crossing

A - Jan not mutated, dies of injuries at hands of Iron Man

17 - Participation in Heroes Reborn

A - Counter-Earth (Franklin) native and Avengers janitor Ernest Sanger would never have become Mant, the size-changing leader of the Remnants

18 - Participation in Destiny War (Possible Immortus picked a different Pym from another era/reality, so things might well have still gone much as seen)

A Doesnt double cross both sides as Yellowjacket

B - Rick Jones does not get involved in final battle

C - Time-Keepers survive

1 No final event prompting Lilandra to sponsor Maximum Security

a Quasar does not absorb Ego

2 - Reality-616 destroyed by Time-Keepers

19 - Curing of Firestars radiation problem

A Leading to earlier or worse cancer/death

20 - Pym not available to supervise treatment and containment of Jack of Hearts unstable physiology

21 - Replacement by Skrull(s)

A - Various Skrulls that replaced him not participate in Initiative/Camp Hammond

B - The Skrulls would have needed another highly placed superhuman genius to replace instead of Hank Pym.

C - No GI-Ant-Man suit for Eric OGrady to steal

1 - OGrady dies in Helicarrier crash, never becomes Ant-Man

D No Skrull relationship with Tigra

1 - William Garson never born

22 - Dark Reign events

A - No Infinite Mansion

B - No Dark Reign-era Mighty Avengers

1 - Amadeus Cho/Vision Jonas/Statures membership negated

2 - Chthon victorious

C - Not named Scientist Supreme

23 - Instruction at Avengers Academy

A - Veil, Hazmat, Mettle - not receiving treatment for various conditions

Is there something in the past we could do to prevent Bendis from inflicting his "vision" onto the entire Marvel Universe? Short of killing him I mean.

[Zexion_Armando]

Nothing wrong with Bendis in this situation, since Age of Ultron occured out of continuity, save for the last 5 pages being real.

As for the set, I wouldn't mind a new Ultron, but otherwise I'd be kind of bleh about the rest, unless we get a new TChalla or something would be nice

[Valo487]

I don't know, I'd say his insistence on everything being NEW HUGE CRACK THE INTERNET IN HALF CHANGE THE MARVEL UNIVERSE FOREVER!!! and not even being close to satisfying is an issue. Reading through that list of what happens if Hank Pym dies, there's no way they were able to devote even a tiny amount of weight to any of those things with everything else going on. That's my big complaint about Bendis, for someone who is so often accused of padding things out for the trades I feel like almost all the content of his books is given little to no weight whatsoever and it just comes off as insignificant.

[Turtle]

My biggest problem with him is how characters tend to not adhere to their own well-established personalities and traits, but rather to Bendis' own archetypes. I admit I'm not a big Bendis fan and have avoided a lot of his work, but a lot of what I have read is just so event driven that you could sub-in about ten other characters for each one used and the story would make about as much sense. Oh, another thing I don't like that Bendis seems to do is telling the reader the story makes sense despite it not making sense. It could be that it just stands out to me, but it seems that every two pages some character has to explain what's happening and why some ridiculous course of action is the only choice (normally when a far easier, obvious, and rational choice is just sitting there). A common comic technique, sure, but something about the way Bendis does it doesn't feel right. But the characters do it with cut-throat wit, so I guess that makes it cool.

[Zexion_Armando]

I think he is doing a great job on the X titles (though I don't have any nice things to say about his avengers run, save for HoM, which I like lol). He seems to have a good handle on the characters, has itroduced a nice ammount of interesting new mutants (some Jason Aaron can't do), and writes some funny dialog.

[TENIME_art]

I would love an Angela Minimate.

But, yeah, it would be kinda saddening to get one before finishing 90's X-Force, any of 90's X-Factor/Generation X/Young X-Men-Academy X-Hellions-whatever you want to call the group compiled of Surge, Rockslide, Anole, Pixie, etc.

[youbastards]

I think Angela is a "strike while the irons hot" type of character. Better to get her Minimate out now before the novelty fades and she goes back into obscurity.

[hellpop]

My biggest problem with him is how characters tend to not adhere to their own well-established personalities and traits, but rather to Bendis' own archetypes. I admit I'm not a big Bendis fan and have avoided a lot of his work, but a lot of what I have read is just so event driven that you could sub-in about ten other characters for each one used and the story would make about as much sense. Oh, another thing I don't like that Bendis seems to do is telling the reader the story makes sense despite it not making sense. It could be that it just stands out to me, but it seems that every two pages some character has to explain what's happening and why some ridiculous course of action is the only choice (normally when a far easier, obvious, and rational choice is just sitting there). A common comic technique, sure, but something about the way Bendis does it doesn't feel right. But the characters do it with cut-throat wit, so I guess that makes it cool.

These are two of his writing tics that bug the hell out of me too. Bendis has been allowed to get away with miswriting characters for the better part of a decade, and it's made me avoid much of his work (in fairness, his work has sold very well, and his boss for much of the time is responsible for one of the great character miswritings of all time, that being "One More Day"). Good writers know that the stories grow from the characters, and that you don't just make the characters fit the story. Bendis simply doesn't get that, or ignores it.

[TENIME_art]

I think Angela is a "strike while the irons hot" type of character. Better to get her Minimate out now before the novelty fades and she goes back into obscurity.

Good point.

[Jatta Pake]

Nothing wrong with Bendis in this situation, since Age of Ultron occured out of continuity, save for the last 5 pages being real.

As for the set, I wouldn't mind a new Ultron, but otherwise I'd be kind of bleh about the rest, unless we get a new TChalla or something would be nice

I think Age of Ultron is 616 continuity.

Wolverine's mucking up of the time-stream breaks the multiverse. But the "real" 616 continuity results in Ultron ultimately victorious.

I think Bendis is trying to ask a philosophical question: If at the end of the day the bad guy "wins" are good guys justified in doing whatever it takes to stop that. This wasn't fully explored in the comics of course. Just hinted at.

What if 616 is better off with Ultron winning? Say a malevolent evil invades Earth and only Ultron can stop it? But the battle ultimately results in the good guys winning over both the evil and Ultron? Sure, a lot of heroes like Hulk are dead but who's to say that isn't also a good thing? A living Hulk always has the potential to become Maestro, right?

I think Wolverine was also wrong reversing the killing of Pym. He took one look at the future and decided he made a mistake. But his look was only a snapshot. Who's to say that the current reality is ultimately any better than the Pym-less universe? Without Pym>Ultron>Vision, there would be no mutant Decimation.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Jatta Pake

[DeganUAB]

Age of Ultron is 616 continuity. It was just erased. Basically it started "in the middle" with the heroes on the ropes and proceded to sort everything out and end with the universe slightly changed by basically the status quo.

@Jake - No they were not better with either Ultron alive or Pym dead. The question the comic asked was, "What if you could kill Hitler? (Or apparently Hitler's Dad in Pym's case.) Wouldn't that make everything better?"

In the Pym-less future the entire Earth is embroiled in a war of Magic which left most of Europe decimated, and the last defense against it is killed in a nuclear explosion that destroys New York. That is not better than everyone basically being fine albeit with a few less people keeping their mutant power IMHO.

[Zexion_Armando]

I think Age of Ultron is 616 continuity.

Wolverine's mucking up of the time-stream breaks the multiverse. But the "real" 616 continuity results in Ultron ultimately victorious.

I think Bendis is trying to ask a philosophical question: If at the end of the day the bad guy "wins" are good guys justified in doing whatever it takes to stop that. This wasn't fully explored in the comics of course. Just hinted at.

What if 616 is better off with Ultron winning? Say a malevolent evil invades Earth and only Ultron can stop it? But the battle ultimately results in the good guys winning over both the evil and Ultron? Sure, a lot of heroes like Hulk are dead but who's to say that isn't also a good thing? A living Hulk always has the potential to become Maestro, right?

I think Wolverine was also wrong reversing the killing of Pym. He took one look at the future and decided he made a mistake. But his look was only a snapshot. Who's to say that the current reality is ultimately any better than the Pym-less universe? Without Pym>Ultron>Vision, there would be no mutant Decimation.

Its interesting, but at the same time, we had a lot of those crossovers with Fantastic Four, Uncanny Avengers, and Superior Spider Man, that show that it wasn't occurring in 616 (the divergence occurred in Avengers Assemble: FCBD or something). And that only a small portion of the last issue takes place in 616, another small portion in 1610, and the rest in the divergent realities like House of M according to the breaking page.

[DeganUAB]

No they take place in the same timeline. It's not divergent. Think of it as if they made a crossover that dealt with the end of the world, but didn't want to stop the rest of comics for 6 months to have crossovers. So there was the point it started (Avengers FCBD) then the whole crossover takes places including the tie-ins (which feature the status quo of all the characters) then the crossover ends right where it began (with the same art from Avengers FCBD) followed by a brief epilogue on how the crossover will affect the Marvel Universe. It's like in Back to the Future when Marty gets back right when he left.

[Lobsterman]

Whoa, this is heavy, Doc!

[bigvis497]

I liked Age of Ultron better when it was Age of Apocalypse.

[JediJohnson]

Whoa, this is heavy, Doc!

What does weight have to do with it?