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Man of Steel


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I argued that the Williams fanfare is like the Bond theme, that it should be somewhere in the score even if only at the very end. That opinion was drowned out by Hans Zimmers' amazing percussion. This is my new favorite superhero soundtrack.

I agree completely. I listened to this while doing the dishes yesterday and it made that terrible task less mundane and more epic.

You don't like doing dishes? 0-o

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Maybe I need to give Superman II another try some time, but that sounds to me like saying '66 Batman is the best Batman movie.

Make sure you watch the Donner cut.

Quite simply, the Reeve movies have the best music, the best Superman and a lot of heart....something that Man of Steel was severely lacking in.

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Maybe I need to give Superman II another try some time, but that sounds to me like saying '66 Batman is the best Batman movie.

In a way, it is. The costumes were the closest to the source material as were the characterizations. If you look through the comics that inspired it at the time, it was pretty authentic.

Decades later Burton came along along and put the Caped Crusader in black rubber suit, vehicles with machine guns, and had the title character kill without regard.

The '66 Batman was a true detective, something sorely missing in the contemporary versions. (With the possible exception of Schumacher's two-film homage to the TV series.)

So while I completely and utterly disagree that Superman II remains in any way the best Superman movie made, I understand the sentiment.

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Well, i just came back from seeing this movie again. I give it a 2/5. A 3/5 and that's me being very generous. The movie didn't feel like Superman, it felt like just another summer blockbuster. I read about the destruction in the movie but what I saw was beyond words. The city was completely obliterated (the parts of it they showed anyway) and mainly that's Clark's fault. He did nothing to move the fight elsewhere and completely destroyed Smallville. He rocketed Zod through a factory without a reason. Zod still had no control over his powers and Supes rockets him towards a factory thus triggering an explosion and killing most of the workers there.

I read some comparisons with the Avengers and MoS and let me tell you the Avengers fought the alien threat a lot more effectively. They helped the people and didn't just go around wrecking buildings. MoS was just an excuse for great special effects. The story was good and was handled good as well but the actors were meh. Cavill, Crowe and Shanon were great but the others not so much. Ma and Pa Kent handled their roles really good but they didn't have that much screentime. Perry was written good and I enjoyed Fishbourne's performance. Faora was a badass and I liked that. Adams was awfull as well as colonel Hardy.

The scene at the end was God-awfull. " How do we know you are not a threat for America?" That's like saying: " You can do whatever the heck you want at the rest of the world and i don't give a shit". It didn't sound like a general carring for his country, it sounded like a guy saying a line while acting wooden. The whole movie felt rushed and pretty wooden. People accuse IM3 of being badly written but it was much, much better written. It was about terorism so the whole patriotic feel made sense and worked. As for MoS it felt flat. I just didn't feel like watching a Superman movie. I felt like watching a movie about an angry but sarcastic guy wrecking buildings. That's a very rough description I know, and the film did develop Superman's character but the fact that he "cared" for humans was not visible.

I guess I'm tired of watching a guy fighting the villain of the day. The concept of having to face the choice of saving your people or your people was great but the performances and the directing made it fall short. The story took the backseat while the heavy in CGI action packed scenes took center stage. So far, IM3 is the best cbm of the year and the Avengers is the best cbm movie ever. Here's my top 5:

The Avengers

TDK

IM

TASM/SM2

IM3

TASM while a reboot still has Peter as a kid with problems both financial and social. TASM took a darker route but it still retained the things that made Spider-Man. MoS through most of them away. What he did to Zod was justified but he didn't feel like the beacon of hope. He was a sarcastic, handsome and rebelious guy. They got his character really well before he put on the suit. That guy, the guy on the oil rig was Superman, the man fighting with the Kryptonians in a blue suit was just another Kryptonian who happened to fight on our side.

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Avengers fought the alien threat because if they didn't show it you'd have a team of people standing around doing absolutely nothing. The studio had to show it just to give screen time. But the only one who really saved anyone was Captain America; the rest just killed aliens with no civilians in sight. The ONLY reason people are comparing this to Avengers is because of how popular the Avengers became. Man of Steel and Avengers are nothing alike outside of being superhero movies and are fairly incomparable.

Someone needs to actually tell me WHY Amy Adams was awful. She was just as fantastic as all of her films; ballsy and snarky with that little grin she plays so effectively. She was 100% Lois; like a combo of 70s Margot Kidder and Animated Dana Delaney. And Fishburne was the MOST wooden by far; he played Perry absolutely nothing like Perry and with Jenny was the worst element of the film. Biggest miscasting.

Your claim about "Threat to America" makes zero sense. Superman has always been an American icon. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. This is the American military. 75% of the film was on American soil. Why would he ask anything but that? In no way did he say "fuck the rest of the world." That may be your weakest point.

Calling Zod the "villain of day" shows that you clearly missed the point of Zod entirely as well, or don't know what "villain of the day" means.

I'm sorry but that review was pretty awful. So many unsubstantiated claims, most of which felt ripped from other reviews. I'm not even saying Man of Steel was great right now, just that most of what you said...wasn't.

(Not purely directed at you, Kostis. Like i said about things pulled from other reviews, i'm seeing stuff you mentioned A LOT elsewhere)

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I got to see MoS last week, and I've got to say, I was impressed. Now, I went into the movie expecting to more or less dislike it. The trailers had definitely gotten me starting to think it'd be ok, but I still wasn't convinced Snyder could it. I've seen most of his other movies, and I just didn't think he could pull off a lot of the nuances that make Superman great. But I was wrong, and my opinion of Zach Snyder as a film maker has changed. Of course, much like Nolan's Batman, this wasn't MY Superman. It was Nolan and Snyder's. Accepting that and moving on, I was really able to appreciate the story they told. I want to especially note that the best part of Superman isn't his powers, his Kryptonian heritage, or his middle America morals. What makes Superman great is that he reconciles both aspects of his existence and allows them to work together to make himself better than either. In other words, Superman > Clark + Kal-El. The movie really played with that, imo,to wonderful effect. I thought Amy Adams was great as Lois, really capturing that intrepid, fearless curiosity. The El and Kent families also captured well the essence of what they were meant to. The villains were great. Zod has been presented so many ways over the years that it's getting tough to make him memorable, but this did it. I thought the weakest link was the Planet team. There wasn't really much there for them to work with, so it's hard to fault the actors. They all could have been anyone, but none of them seemed especially like who they were meant to be.

There were certainly some faults, but the first thing to remember is that this was Superman's first outing. The thing in Smallville... I wish that he had at least realized too late, mid-fight, that he had just brought the battle to a populated area. In Metropolis, I don't know what else he could have done. Seemed to me like he had done all he could at that point to prevent further destruction. On Zod, what happened there doesn't sit well, bit I see what they were doing and why. And I'm going to go ahead and guess that the birthing matrix wasn't as damaged as Superman led Zod to believe. It would be a shame to have completely destroyed the test-tube city and the flying fortress of solitude.

Edited by Turtle
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Avengers fought the alien threat because if they didn't show it you'd have a team of people standing around doing absolutely nothing. The studio had to show it just to give screen time. But the only one who really saved anyone was Captain America; the rest just killed aliens with no civilians in sight. The ONLY reason people are comparing this to Avengers is because of how popular the Avengers became. Man of Steel and Avengers are nothing alike outside of being superhero movies and are fairly incomparable.

Someone needs to actually tell me WHY Amy Adams was awful. She was just as fantastic as all of her films; ballsy and snarky with that little grin she plays so effectively. She was 100% Lois; like a combo of 70s Margot Kidder and Animated Dana Delaney. And Fishburne was the MOST wooden by far; he played Perry absolutely nothing like Perry and with Jenny was the worst element of the film. Biggest miscasting.

Your claim about "Threat to America" makes zero sense. Superman has always been an American icon. Truth, Justice, and the American Way. This is the American military. 75% of the film was on American soil. Why would he ask anything but that? In no way did he say "fuck the rest of the world." That may be your weakest point.

Calling Zod the "villain of day" shows that you clearly missed the point of Zod entirely as well, or don't know what "villain of the day" means.

I'm sorry but that review was pretty awful. So many unsubstantiated claims, most of which felt ripped from other reviews. I'm not even saying Man of Steel was great right now, just that most of what you said...wasn't.

(Not purely directed at you, Kostis. Like i said about things pulled from other reviews, i'm seeing stuff you mentioned A LOT elsewhere)

I didn't have a problem with Superman being an American icon. That's the whole point. That he fights for Truth, Justice and the American Way. It's just that I didn't see that. All I saw was a reckless young man fighting a superpowered enemy and not showing that he cared for those around him.

I didn't mean that Zod was the villain of the week, that was a weak comparison and I'm sorry. I meant that in most movies they just fight the bad guy and that's it. In Cap he fought Red Skull and that's it. In MoS he fought the bad guy and that's it. I wanted to see a bit more of the consequences. I wanted to see how Clark dealt with all this. Instead we just got him being sarcastic to a general and creating the journalist persona.

Adams was awful in the sense that her chemistry with Clark was non existent. The kiss at the end was unneeded. The whole city was being atacked, the blocks they were standing on we're decimated and they just stood there, kissing. It didn't make their relationship more compelling.

What I'm trying to say is that while the film had great ideas it didn't deliver that much. Here;

Zod-excellent

Clark Kent-excellent

Kal-El-excellent

Jor-El-excellent

Superman- not that great

Story-excellent in its concept but we needed to see more of the consequences it had on Clark.

I think they pushed the story back in order to make room for the action so to wow audiences and create buzz. Maybe the next movie touches on the destruction by adding Lex who will help rebuild the city, though that's impossible since that would cost some trillions of dollars ( analysists say so).

I just didn't enjoy it that much. Now that I'm thinking again about it a 2/5 is pretty low but a 3/5 is pretty good. And the Avengers comparison was made by some guys on Flickr who wanted to make me believe that Dc films are always sophisticated while Marvel makes campy and corny movies.

Edited by Kostisfire
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MoS reminds me of DKR. It's not great nor horrible, it exists. Both movies did nothing for me. That might be worse than being bad. I saw both movies on the big screen and I'm thinking about not doing so for upcoming DC movies. I just don't care. It was such a dull experience. The fight scenes had some brutal ideas going for them but reminded me of Transformers. And Superman flying looked off for some reason. Superman can kill for all I care, sometimes that's what has to be done. The argument about sacrifice and making the world small doesn't work for me. He killed more humans than Zod did. I know it was done to prevent Zod from committing genocide but still, he was like a kid in a playpen. When he destroys all these lives it makes all his rescue efforts seem moot. Especially when you consider earth's people are the ones he wants to protect. I was actually rooting for Zod to be honest, just because a lot of stuff didn't make sense. And Clark didn't have any heart nor emotion. I thought the acting was okay, action was pretty fun in general. Writing could've been better. I understand the love for the movie, just like with DKR. And I'm happy for the DC fans. I just hope they raise the bar if they ever make a Justice League movie.

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wow...you guys try fighting 3 angry kryptonian warriors and a giant robot thats terraforming the earth while serving as a gravity nuke, even with super powers, I'd expect even more causalities than in the film.

also the reason I hated Amy Adams are as follows: (and yes some of these may be more problems with the writing and not with her performance)

1. she was in almost every scene for no reason, "we need her on our kryptonian ship because...well idk...shes the only human whose name we know"

2. she was jimmy olsen....just...weird

3. she tried to be sarcastic or ball-busting and just ended up looking awkward and uncomfortable

4. she was kind of an idiot...when you're being chased by the FBI, you think going out the back door is going to help you?

5. Lois Lane is supposed to be a strong, reckless, independent and intelligent reporter, and even when she is going gaga for supes in the comics, she still acts unimpressed.

everything other than Amy Adams/ Lois Olsen was fantastic

Zod was breathtaking and Shannon pulled it off greatly.

Foara was the best female role in a film all year...and maybe last year as well

Cavil felt like a new Superman, a man trying to become what he thinks Superman is, this is a world (that as far as we know) does not have super heroes, and we throw a guy into a fight where he has to become one, i didnt expect him to get it right, i just expected him to try his hardest, and Cavil really pulled off the idea of Clark Kent trying to become Superman for me

Jon Kent and Jor-El had some great scenes but didnt dominate the film, which was nice.

also i find it hilarious how for YEARS, people have complained that we have never seen a full scale Superman fight, then we get the best one we could hope for, and everyone complains about it because a Superman who has never fought anyone in his life, cant manage to make a kryptonian general get to an unpopulated area. (you guys did see all the parts where Zod pulls him back down into fighting through the city right?)

Edited by undeadpool
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I'm not saying the opposite. Supes tried his best, but the part where he flies him through the factory for no reason (yes he was threatening Ma Kent but he had no reason to fly him through there, he could shoot him into space) seemed awkward. In the Superman/Batman series Waller created a Doomsday type of creature but made of Kryptonite and she made it attack Superman in Smallvile. In the comic Supes tried not to hurt anyone and tried to save them by giving them directions. In the movie instead of telling them to leave through the back door he just told them to stay inside. Sure, it was the best he could do and he had to fight 2 kryptonians and the damage wasn't that terrible so I can excuse this.

But the fight in the city could have been contained. Supes was busy with that other machine but seriously, an army general, the best reporter and a genius proffesor couldn't figure out that you had to turn that part a bit so it lines with the others? Had they done that earlier the fight could have been contained and the fact that he just stood there kissing Lois was out of place. Superman puts others first and then does whatever he has in mind. The 1 on 1 fight with Zod didn't cause that much destruction as far as I can remember.

Overall, I guess my problem is with the writing. It just seemed that they wanted to have many explosions, Bay style. It was a movie where the only thing you remember are the explosions and the destruction. And the way Superman (not Clark or Kal, just Superman) was written just didn't do it for me.

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well i think he was trying to make the superman movie everybody asked for, but i guess didnt want

for years and years (even during Superman Returns release) all i've heard is people complaining that we dont have a movie where Superman fights someone, uses all of his powers, shows what would happen if someone like Superman existed and fought another person with equal power, like what that would do to the world.

I also think this is all gonna work if we do a sequel, think about it, Luthor comes in and rebuilds the city pro bono and becomes a hero, meanwhile cadmus is formed out of the fear of kryptonians and starts building doomsday or cyborg supes or someone along those lines so destruction like this wont happen again (i know it doesnt quite work that way but thats how it happens in the comics)

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My pitch was that Superman was the catalyst for the formation of the Justice League; a group of people with his powers (or better) to stop him should the need arise. I always thought that would be a paranoid, anti-Super Friends twist on the team's origin.

And if Superman joins the JL then all the better. "... keep your enemies closer."

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well i think he was trying to make the superman movie everybody asked for, but i guess didnt want

for years and years (even during Superman Returns release) all i've heard is people complaining that we dont have a movie where Superman fights someone, uses all of his powers, shows what would happen if someone like Superman existed and fought another person with equal power, like what that would do to the world.

I also think this is all gonna work if we do a sequel, think about it, Luthor comes in and rebuilds the city pro bono and becomes a hero, meanwhile cadmus is formed out of the fear of kryptonians and starts building doomsday or cyborg supes or someone along those lines so destruction like this wont happen again (i know it doesnt quite work that way but thats how it happens in the comics)

I wanted to see action on a Superman movie and Snyder delivered on that. He also delivered on making a great story and fleshing out Clak, Kal but not Superman. Everything about the movie was great, except from how Superman acted.

My pitch was that Superman was the catalyst for the formation of the Justice League; a group of people with his powers (or better) to stop him should the need arise. I always thought that would be a paranoid, anti-Super Friends twist on the team's origin.

And if Superman joins the JL then all the better. "... keep your enemies closer."

That'd be an interesting twist but I doubt that would happen. An Amazon Princess, an Atlantean King and a space cop would not cooperate with the government.

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My pitch was that Superman was the catalyst for the formation of the Justice League; a group of people with his powers (or better) to stop him should the need arise. I always thought that would be a paranoid, anti-Super Friends twist on the team's origin.

And if Superman joins the JL then all the better. "... keep your enemies closer."

I like that. A bit like when Fury says to Thor on the Helicarrier (paraphrasing) 'we have to use the tesseract to build weapons because of you, because even though you may not be a threat, we know you're not the only one out there we might need to stop'

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That'd be an interesting twist but I doubt that would happen. An Amazon Princess, an Atlantean King and a space cop would not cooperate with the government.

What government? This group would be funded privately by Lex Luthor, Bruce Wayne, and Oliver Queen. cool.png

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That'd be an interesting twist but I doubt that would happen. An Amazon Princess, an Atlantean King and a space cop would not cooperate with the government.

What government? This group would be funded privately by Lex Luthor, Bruce Wayne, and Oliver Queen. cool.png

I could see any of these options being totally plausible, too. (Hey, Lex did run the "Superfirends" in Young Justice)

After Diana/Steve Trevor (if it was the play out like the New 52), i would assume all ties to the US Gov would be out of the question, even more reason for Lex and the Gov to force distrust in Superman.

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*has been writing a DC elseworld where Luthor formed the justice league for about 6 months now*

I really hope thats what happens, it opens up so many possibilities

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