monkeycrumb

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nacelle So, today's Q&A still has the vague answer of "waiting for retail sales & fan response" regarding wave 2. Let's hope we hear something before October's NYCC.

Thankfully, none of mine look like that! Looks like a bad pull from the mold.

Exactly. Which really makes me wonder. Does BB just have a higher profit margin? I know they own the license, but there's a lot of tooling costs. The only thing that would make Trek more expensive would be if they have to pay a percentage of sales, since they've already paid for the license. I really believe Trek is profitable, but it's the degree of profitability that's the key question. Why chase pennies when you can make dollars instead? That is the Mattel / Hasbro / everyone else model, so it's logical to assume it's in play here. And IIRC, DST had stated they do what they can to keep all the manufacturing done at the same 1-2 plant(s), so resources are a factor. And I'd sacrifice BB to get more Calico Jack, but if BB is more profitable than CJ, it's understandable why they make the decisions they make. That LCBS CJ 4-pack never got enough presales to get it produced and it was a DST-owned license. I guess our Trek salvation comes mainly from TRU. I really hope that should TRU pass, DST will continue to make Trek for the LCS market. If Trek fails, the only future it has at retail is with another TV series. Otherwise, we'll probably just get more Captains with the 3rd movie . So DST needs to stop holding back and just give us the fan requested stuff. (And by holding back, I mean the great ones they hold back to "Anchor" waves with, such as Data, Worf, Locutus, etc.)

First off, Where is this wave at? Show yourself! I expect them to pop up any day now, and I'm sure they're at least on the boat to the US by now, right? Second, it's kinda interesting the lack of interest that the Phoenix 5 members are getting. Yes, a lot of members want them, but it seems almost equal between the want / don't want crowds. I guess that's why the DST Q&A today mentioned not the expect the last 2 to get made anytime soon. Which is a bit sad. I hate unfinished teams, but there's a ton of stuff I still want first. But the hard part is that the further we get away from their storyline's release, the less likely we'll ever see them done. I'd certainly take them over another Wolvie variant. It just sucks to be a single 2-pack away from completing a team or theme, and we have a bunch of those near-completes already.

Which was the worst selling set of all time, Alpha Flight 1, Alpha Flight 2, or Thor? Just curious. Hey now! Those were actually great sets! Thor was only disappointing with the Beta Ray Bill triple re-use (TRU, LCBS & here). Loki was incredible, Sif was a very welcome addition, and Thor was to be expected when the set is called Thor, but still a good figure. Alpha Flight, while a team I have no interest in whatsoever, is still well made, complete, and all new figures, no rereleases! It was really sad these didn't do better, because the principal behind them was one I'd love to see carried forward (Wrecking Crew!). Now it looks like we're not going to get any real team-builder 4-packs that don't have A-listers in them As for the Iron Man 3 AFX SDCC set, I figured it was better to get one in person than to pay shipping later. It's still a very unexciting set but it wasn't really made for us anyway. But an inclusion of "Dummy" the robot would have gone a loooong way to making this set better and would have fit in perfectly, and I'd have paid an extra $5 to have him in there.

Since Chuck has mentioned J&SBSB as one of their focus points, I'd really love to see a George Carlin minimate! I'd buy an extra just for a Rufus custom for sure

Meh. Trek has been out for about a month now. How much longer do we need to wait before we hear what the "fan and retailer response" was before we hear any more about Trek's future? I know, I know, it's basically up to TRU wanting to order more. Because they already have their initial sales data, and word of mouth sounds very positive on sales as well.

Can I just admit how much I like the gun that comes with Dr Smith? It's neat! And as for what I said about hairpieces, I really think they can find pre-existing pieces for the guys (Hail Ivan!) and just need new tools for the girls. And more ray guns are always welcome. And MisterPL, looking at your pics, I see that the collar doesn't match what we got on Dr Smith, and I really find I don't mind because it still looks great. (re-used from TWOK Kirk)

C'mon now, not everything can be as hip and fresh as Thief of Thieves to warrant an entire 4-pack!

YES. I'd buy an extra for my Samwise Gamgee mate to carry

I don't think that, and that's not what I said. I'm tired of what's been done before. The robot & spaceshit has been marketed to death. When I said "but how much of it has never been done before?", the answer is Not Much, except the entire family as I mentioned. I remember the 9" dolls made by the same company that made those ugly Babylon 5 dolls. I bought the Trendmasters stuff from the movie on clearance, those were fun toys at clearance prices. IIRC, Trendmasters didn't do 3 3/4" classic figures. I bought a few of the Johnny Lightnings. But as for what has worked before and what hasn't, the issue of every company has always been tooling costs. And there lies my frustration. Minimates don't have to tool up an entire figure from scratch like a 3 3/4 " line would need to. If tooling costs weren't an issue, Trendmasters would have surely made a 3 3/4" line back when the movie came out. But by looking at "what worked before" ignores the issue that the main concern preventing a profitable line of classic figures in the past isn't currently an issue for Minimates. Costs are relatively cheaper, so the issue should be if and how to get them out. I don't think they've ever made the girl (Penny?) as a toy before, and if that's the case, do you mean to say it can't be done just because of old data that says what works & what doesn't? If DST wanted to do 4-packs, throwing her in one with stronger sellers would have been best. And Minimate collectors are more prone to "collect them all" instead of cherry-picking single releases like action figures. And when you say this is a "one-and-done" property, I agree with you. But I also expected just what you mentioned - two 4-packs and maybe a vehicle. I think DST really made a mistake going B&W for the SDCC release. I totally get their intent, by making something not ultimately "necessary" for later collections in color (ala Dale & Walking Dead B&W set), but I really fear the poor sales on them will affect their overall opinion on the future of this line. Plus, I really want Dr Smith in color just to see him turn up in more of the minimate comic strips the members here make - he's got such a "Creepy Uncle" vibe

Closer to scale, maybe? Not huge. And your pic shows the Ent-A, not the TOS ship, which my fuzzy memory tells me the -A is notably bigger than the original.

Minimates are as close to retail perfection as this nerd has ever seen. These are essentially "impulse-buy" pricepoints. Sure, the larger packs are pricier, but at the 2-pack prices from the time the line started 10 years ago to today, they continue to be great value for the price. So many things I'd have a passing interest in in another format becomes an Instant-Buy in Minimate form. As much as I liked Terminator/Star Trek/etc, I've picked up only a smattering of other lines pieces due to cost and size. But I've bought every single Minimate religiously. I've never bought a Lost In Space product before, save for maybe the old Johnny Lightning $6 die-casts, and now I really want everything possible from that license. I've never bought a single Thundercats, Universal Monster, Knight Rider, Munsters, BTTF or Battlestar Galactica item before, but for Minimates, the price was right! Minimates are my generation's Mego's. Large variety of licenses in a similar affordable format. Ultimately customizable. Willing to give us characters that no other company will. It's rare to get supporting cast with any license that's not Star Wars, so Minimates provide a more complete lineup of characters. And what doesn't get made is easily customized or quick-customed (for the most part) And the biggest draw? The artistry! There's plenty of cheap toys out there, so why Minimates? The characterization present in the facial expressions. There's so much personality infused into 2 inches of toy. I can slap a coat of pain on anything and call it a different character, but to replicate a DST-style face is the real trick. Especially with no noses, DST really manages to work miracles with their artistry. Minimates give such personality to their minimates that properties I have no interest in, no knowledge of, or little interest in become interesting to me. And it's inexpensive enough to collect them all. ($30ish for a set of 8 minimates equates to only 3 Marvel Universe figures!) So I want them just for their artistic appeal to me. If I like the design, I want it! I never even watched Lost In Space, but that Robot is one neat toy! And the appeal is that he's in scale and stylisticly fits in with my entire minimate collection. I have no interest in an out-of-scale accurate replica of any size. And I like old Horror and Sci-Fi designs, mainly due to Minimate Wishlisting. And the best part about retail perfection? I can GET them! None of this one-per-case rare variant nonsense. I can order a full wave and it's all good! I'm done with "The Hunt", I refuse to waste time, gas & money searching for toys. I like to look, but I don't want to be forced to "chase" anything. I've not been thrilled with a lot of the promo-mates, but they are the exception, not the rule. Hasbro's Marvel lines are unbelievably frustrating to collect. Minimates don't require me to prebuy an entire case just to get a full set. I collect a TON of stuff: Star Wars, Lego, etc. But Minimates remain my passion for the reasons I just gave. But my passion was ignited by buying those TRU 4-packs with 5th "hidden character" and just playing with them and breaking them apart to custom make different figures. It was just a lot of fun! It really spoke to the toy-collector in me.

If the family were to come in a series of 2-packs with the Robot repeated in every pack, I'd still buy every pack. It's both maddening and saddening that the greatest strength of Minimates is rarely the actual focus. I wish DST all the best with their non-minimate stuff, but how much of it has never been done before? Nobody's ever made the family IIRC. Aside from maybe a new hairpiece or a few, the entire family can be made with absolutely no further new tooling needed. Stuff like this makes me really wish they would go the way of a multi-license assortment, ala Movie Maniacs, for properties that can barely sustain more than one 2-pack at a time. DST already feels this approach is necessary for Star Trek, I'd love to see it applied to something like a catch-all Sci-Fi or Horror line. (I don't expect it'll ever happen, just wishlisting ) I sincerely hope DST gets that Robot minimate back out in color at least, as well as a color version of the Dr Smith they did in b&w. Robot B9 is one of the coolest this year, and I wouldn't complain if I wind up with a ton of him.

Holy crap YB! Nice pile of Enterprises! If anyone else is interested, if you plan on ever customizing a set of JJ Trek mates, the current Fighter Pods Enterprise that TRU carries for $20 almost matches the minimates Enterprise, although it's a bit larger, but stylistically would work. And if you absolutely hate JJ Trek, the deflector dish opens up to hold a large quantity of fireworks

There was no "cooler packaging". Mine at least had a blank background inside. I've already tossed out the package. Pepper is cool at least. Yeah, I'm a sucker I did buy 2 LiS packs, and I wish I'd bought more. This IM3 pack was just to "complete the collection", not because I really wanted it. I'll probably customize the armors into some unmade ones.

Hellpop, I think UM should have been more limited in quantity. Selling out would have easier if they weren't backing up at retail and LCBS. And I am NOT saying "it's the people", I've BEEN saying it's a combination! I've been saying that all along and everyone keeps misreading me and arguing with me against something I'm not even saying! I was actually not a UM fan until minimates, believe it or not. But even the regulars here were talking about passing on the duplicates. It was grossly overproduced and exceeded what the market could bear. I've been saying this all along and people keep talking about leftovers at their TRU like it's supposed to defeat my argument. The quality of the product was also noticably lacking. When stores are drowning in an excess of older waves, stores aren't going to order the newer waves. What happened with the begining of Marvel minimates, when things like Ultimate X-Men and all of those other first wave mates were shared between TRU & LCBS? They backed up and went on clearance. Did that mean the license was no good? Was no longer viable? So if DST has learned, and Marvel, and Star Trek, have different versions between markets, why is it so hard to expect that possibly UM might have better luck following the same strategy? I'm just floored that people are holding some lines to different standards than others. If Marvel can't work with the same exact figures shared between TRU & LCBS, why are we expecting other lines to be successful with that strategy? I'm not going to do this again. I'm not going to ask questions or share answers or observations from conventions. This has been incredibly frustrating to make my point only to have people misinterpret what I say or make arguments for what was said when they weren't part of the conversation. This has been incredibly disappointing and I really wish I hadn't bothered. I'll ask questions at cons for my own enlightenment, it's just not worth sharing when people choose to attack the messenger just for relaying the message. And Zach states it best. I never would have stated my case like I did if those were the answers I had received at the con. Zach's answers make sense. Chuck's were contradictory. I'm done with this thread.

Not taking it personally re: death of UM, Zombie. And I've been giving the creators plenty of benefit of the doubt. I just have too much intelligence to accept a contradictory statement from anyone when they are ascribing 100% of the blame away from themselves. It's just jarring to hear someone in that position make such a bold claim. Just like the statement about avoiding POTA just because Kubricks already did it. Not because it might not sell enough, but because Kubricks already did it. I'm not here to complain that UM is over, I'm taking issue with what was specifically said to me. And it seems like what I'm relaying keeps getting twisted here.

Just to clarify Hellpop, I spoke with Chuck at the booth Sunday, I missed the Saturday panel. And I think DST made a mistake going with black & white sets for SDCC. Even a "hot" line like Walking Dead has trouble moving that b&w Dale pack. But I'm sure the blame will be placed squarely on the license, not DST's decision to go b&w for the SDCC exclusives if my talk with Chuck on the Universal Monsters is any indication. Shame too, because it's an awesome set!

Sure, decades worth of successful merchandising, and you want to imply I'm the one in denial here? Over a conversation you weren't a party to and are reading about second hand? That's kind of presumptuous, isn't it? Because placing the blame *solely* on the license is just BS, since there's several sides involved here. If you want to argue what side has more share of the blame, that's fine and perfectly debatable. And when someone blames the license in one sentence then states they're doing another wave of a different type of toy with the same property in a different sentence, doesn't that strike you as contradictory? And as for Thief of Thieves, DST has the license for multiple CBS properties, you don't see them making them all do you? Why should ToT get made just because they have the license? They obviously feel like it's economically viable for them to do so. And just because they can, does not mean they will or should in every case. It's a case of DST keeping Kirkman happy.

I hear you, and I agree TRU is the 800-pound gorilla. But a few years ago they managed Star Trek for 5 waves without TRU involved. I think any property is sellable IF the numbers can be worked out - even Golden Girls would probably sell 10 sets total if the price was right (of course it's not going to be to only manufacture 10 sets ). And yes, TRU killed off Calico Jack wave 2. I want a bunch of properties, but I also know most of them aren't financially viable (Babylon 5) in terms of needed sales. The reason Universal Monsters isn't "viable" now as minimates is because it was bungled enough to begin with. So retailers aren't willing to take a chance again with more right now. Same thing happened to Star Trek after wave 3 backed up at retailers as well. It took DST years before they admitted their character selection was not up to snuff and part of the problem. And DST tells us Thief of Thieves is expected to have better sales than Star Trek or Universal Monsters. Sorry to keep going off on rants here, but I know denial when I hear it. Yup. Clerks is "timeless comedy" or "holds up well" or something like that, isn't that what Chuck said? But not Harry freaking Potter? Which one has multiple theme parks again? Probably because most people buying were keeping for themselves? The clears were almost all gone on Sunday, black bases were plentiful, and the mix & match action bases were still plentiful.

I think there were a few ways to help it sell better. Bottom line is I think they got greedy by splitting the same figures between specialty & TRU. Notice how all of the TRU exclusives are sold out? That was likely around the right number to manufacture. Notice how Trek doesn't have the exact same figures in both markets right now? That's the way DST should have gone if they wanted to split markets. Not many people were going to buy both of the same Draculas, Frankensteins, etc in both the 4-packs and again in the 2-packs. DST way overshot their market and overproduced more than the market could bear. All of those "impulse-buys" they were counting on at TRU were likely hurt by the 1-star online reviews as to the shoddy quality. I highly suspect the molds were due to be replaced at the time these were manufactured, as the parts don't hold together very well and fall apart constantly. We know what we're getting into, not every impulse buyer understands when they see loose parts floating inside the package. I think if they had even changed expresssions on characters between markets it would have helped a bit. Preferably different characters or variants. Lord knows they do if for Marvel, but UM is expected to sell well this way? Nope, gotta be the license's fault! I'm sorry, but if you're having trouble making a profit on Dracula & Frankenstein, there's a problem. And Chuck told me they still plan on getting out one more wave of the UM action figures. But sure, blame the license Chuck! Stack32, feel free to side with Chuck, but they are not without fault on the decisions made. I gave plenty of concessions to them having all of the data, but data alone isn't any guarantee of success. I respect the guy, but nobody is perfect, nobody is infallible. The Mummy wound up being TRU exclusive, and those sold out. Turtle, I'm sorry you have UM still hanging around your area at $2. Why haven't you snatched those up for fodder? Seriously, Marvel's been clearanced plenty of times, and it's not the license's fault. More have been manufactured than the market can bear. As for Star Trek - TOS is the only great seller huh? How much recent data do they have, exactly? Back in the heydey of Trek, there was so much product, it was overwhelming. They did very well with their TNG figures and multiple variants, they should know TNG product will sell. DS9 and their 7" Enterprise figures came at a time when a lot of people were feeling franchise fatigue. There are a lot of people who won't spend $15-$20 on a single figure, but would be happy to buy a 2-pack of minimates for under $10. I rather thought the whole selling-point of minimates from a company's standpoint is that the block figure means minimal tooling. The reason we never got a 7" scale Quark was because tooling was too much for profitability. It's practically asinine to think that a production run of 3000 box sets (the number of LiS 2packs made, just using the same numbers here) to complete a few crews (especially TNG!) can't sell. It's mostly minimal tampos and barely any new tooling! Again, compare to Thundercats! The license is already paid for, and production costs would be far cheaper than Thundercats. But the main thing is that DST finally got Trek product back into TRU after the Playmates crapfest from 2009. And instead of maintaining that foothold, they've taken a wait-and-see approach instead of striking while the iron is hot. I've said all along, I don't have all the info, I don't know all of the specifics. But it's easier to armchair-quarterback after the fact. My concern is that Chuck was placing the fault in the wrong direction, and to me that is troublesome reasoning. I would have been happy to buy Playmates 2009 Star Trek stuff but it was garbage. I'm not saying that about DST's stuff, but while UM isn't as hot of a property, it's not the license's fault entirely that the line didn't sell as well as it could have. Look again at Knight Rider - a variation for each market. I don't see those on clearance.

I'm willing to bet the entire 2nd wave of BB were designed before the first wave even saw release. DST owns the license and have invested heavily in it. It did seem to sell through well enough at TRU at least. I suspect the low-profit margin properties are being sacrificed in favor of BB (i.e. Munsters, Universal Monsters, further Knight Rider that was mentioned, etc) Yeah, sorry, I'm not a Kubrick expert, so thanks I do know that block-style Pulp Fiction figures have been done before, but still the whole "it's been done before" attitude would kill the collectables market! I agree with you 99%!! The remaining 1% is that my wife would expect me to buy her her own set

Winkerbean, I love that pic! Put an exclamation point at the end and I'd love to wear that as a T-Shirt to ever convention DST attends Groundhog, thanks. I understand Chuck has to prioritize and do what works best for the company. But yeah, many companies fight over the rights to Universal Monsters, we've gotten a steady stream of products from a variety of companies over the past few decades, but "nope, not enough money in it" according to Chuck. Again, I don't know all of the specifics on license costs, other costs, etc. But I like to think I have a good grasp at why some things fail at retail. The problems with the UM mates could have been solved, but cheaply enough? (I really like to think so, but again I am not privvy to the company's financial details, but minimal tooling compared to other lines!) So, man I don't want to sound negative. But yeah, blaming the license isn't the way for any company to go! And Palisades Palz (or someone similar) already did Pulp Fiction, so why the sudden "it's been done" attitude with POTA and Kubricks? I'd rather he just told me he didn't think it would be profitable enough, but that might not be something any company rep wants to say. I have enough friends in PR, I know a lot about how the game is played. Which is why I was a bit over-critical on Thief of Thieves, because how many times have we heard how civilians don't sell, such-and-such property won't wok, but suddenly hey, this property is great and we're thrilled to be working with so-and-so! Even beloved properties can fail if there are disconnects between what the company wants to give us and what the fans are willing to put up with (see Hasbro's recent fail with Phantom Menace product!). From too much or too little different product or production runs, to the quality of the final piece(s). Same with their previous issues with the first line of Star Trek a few years back. Chuck was quoting sales from that as an indication. It sounds like he blamed other licenses (one TNG pack then one DS9 pack) hurt the strong TOS sales, which is bull. They made bad choices, plain and simple, which is why the all-TOS wave 3 is still widely available at or below cost! I just hope they look inward as well as outward as to why some lines don't meet expectations. I don't want them making Hasbro-esqe Phantom Menace mistakes. I'd rather miss out on some properties than have them make a company-destroying mistake (like Palisades did, may they RIP!) But as an opinionated a-hole on the internet, I love to give them my feedback I agree with Groundhog, Minimates are my most stable toy fix on the market. They are my passion, and I criticize out of love. I just want them to shutupandtakemymoney! Respectfully.

One thing really concerned me about my talk with Chuck: He seems to think that every "failure" is due to lack of interest in the license, NOT the presentation! (MY impression of our talk, NOT his words!) His blaming of the Universal Monsters not selling well doesn't take into account the many problems that line had: serious lack of "perceived value" that lines need - lack of accessories & extra parts, plus the figure distribution was cannibalizing sales between markets! The Mummy sets sold spectacularly due to the sarcophagus and the lack of repeats between markets. Add to that the public complaints about quality on the TRU website product reviews - this line was notorious for parts falling off (Creature being the biggest offender here) As for Munsters, not every minimate collector collects vehicles! And it's so sad because that car was incredible. But again we miss out on getting the rest of the family, when one box set would be an easy sell, and two box sets would be do-able. I was surprised that LiS was still so abundant on Sunday. It was hands down my most anticipated set, and I am not a fan of the show. I just love seeing classic designs made into minimates. The only thing stopping me from buying every one they had was that they were black & white instead of color. I have to admit, carded the B-9 Robot isn't as impressive due to the arm positioning in the package makes the body kinda flare out and look silly. It's once you open the package and position his arms the way they are intended, this is one spectacular minimate! Again, with Lost in Space especially, nothing says dated, old property like releasing it in black & white! I love the Robot, and I want to really love the Doctor Smith figure, but in B&W, he doesn't really "pop" like he should if you want to sell product.I really hope they don't short change LiS's future based on the convention pack sales! Even a lot of collectors here said they would pass on B&W mates. As for Chuck's statement about the POTA Kubricks, I really didn't have time to get into a detailed discussion with him regarding all the other properties they've done that have had Kubricks (Aliens!) I guess he wasn't impressed with their Mego-style sales they did a few years back. I hate the Mego style, sorry! And the price point is hugely different! I would have picked up a few Mego-styles at the Minimate pricepoint! I know I'm not privvy to the financial details that Chuck is, but I really feel they are abandoning concepts too quickly, and throwing out the baby with the bath water instead of really looking at why they didn't meet their projected goals. Do you REALLY think that everyone buying the Thundercats or Battle Beasts are fans of those properties? Or maybe a good portion of those sales are due more to the quality & presentation? Do you think that a Universal Monsters line overflowing with accessories and limited to one market wouldn't do just as well?? (Likely the license was an order of magnitude more expensive, but still, cut the profit margin a little slimmer and it should have been done like Thundercats!) I just didn't care for the "we already went there" attitude, when there was room for improvement in several aspects. How much better would a Creature From The Black Lagoon do if he had the double-ring-pegs to keep the feet / etc from falling out do in TRU reviews? Limited to only one market and packed with unique characters and accessories? Give it 3-5 years before trying again, but it's still viable at market. I really hope that Chuck understands that not all fault is due to the consumers. Tell me LiS wouldn't have sold better in color. Even the hot line of Walking Dead had that B&W Dale set that's still pegwarming at Lukes & my LCBS!